The Shriver Report – Gender Equality Is a Myth!
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Gender Equality Is a Myth!

By Beyoncé Knowles-Carter

We need to stop buying into the myth about gender equality. It isn’t a reality yet. Today, women make up half of the U.S. workforce, but the average working woman earns only 77 percent of what the average working man makes. But unless women and men both say this is unacceptable, things will not change. Men have to demand that their wives, daughters, mothers, and sisters earn more—commensurate with their qualifications and not their gender. Equality will be achieved when men and women are granted equal pay and equal respect.

If women received pay equal to their male counterparts, the U.S. economy would produce $447.6 billion in additional income.
A Woman's Nation Pushes Back From The Brink

Humanity requires both men and women, and we are equally important and need one another. So why are we viewed as less than equal? These old attitudes are drilled into us from the very beginning. We have to teach our boys the rules of equality and respect, so that as they grow up, gender equality becomes a natural way of life. And we have to teach our girls that they can reach as high as humanly possible.

[Related: America's Working Single Mothers: An Appreciation by LeBron James]

We have a lot of work to do, but we can get there if we work together. Women are more than 50 percent of the population and more than 50 percent of voters. We must demand that we all receive 100 percent of the opportunities.

Do you agree with Beyonce? Let us know on Twitter!

This is an excerpt from The Shriver Report: A Woman’s Nation Pushes Back from the Brink, in partnership with the Center for American Progress. DOWNLOAD THE REPORT HERE. 

 

Have HBO? Be sure to tune in on March 17th to see our documentary produced in association with HBO, Paycheck to Paycheck: The Life and Times of Katrina Gilbert, which shows an intimate portrait of one family’s life living on the brink of poverty.

Also on The Shriver Report:

The Shriver Report aims to ignite conversations about our modern realities, however comments that are obscene, sexually explicit or include hate speech will be removed.
  • Calvin

    I understand that gender equality is most definitely an issue in the first world (and even more so in the third world), but the “50% of the workforce, 77% percent of what a man makes” argument has a bunch of flaws in it.

    First of all, there may be the same amount of women in the work force, but on average, they work less hours, accumulating less pay. They also accumulate less pay when they go on paternity leave.

    Secondly, the billionaires who skew the average pay system big time are mostly men. This is more a biological thing than anything. These jobs usually require a lot of aggressiveness to obtain. Testosterone = aggressiveness, which is most likely why more men are billionaires, which skew the average pay towards men.

    I do sincerely believe that more steps should be taken to achieve gender equality, I just believe better examples should be used to showcase the trouble that women face. I hope this comment didn’t come across as sexist, and I welcome people to poke holes in my theory.

    • babananas

      You do make some good points! we definitely have to consider biology when we talk about equality. However, I don’t think that working less hours has anything to do with biology. Also, women can definitely be agressive, but they’re thaught its not feminine (they may get called “bitches”) and they’re just seen as less powerful/capable which I think is the problem. More people with a progressive and open mind could change this! :)

      • joules

        a big part of the whole “men dominate the CEO world” is the fact that 20 years ago if you look at University grad books and statistics, men are the only ones graduating with professional degrees. This very clearly translates into their earnings today as well as their standing in the workforce

        • http://simplifilm.com/ Chris Johnson

          And now more women – by far -are post grads.

          • Ben Lucas

            at which time women should theoretically be paid more than men and then we can start this whole victim-hood cycle all over again.

          • Tracheal

            Who at Harvard Business School are being schooled on how to raise their hands….just like kindergarten kids. Equal much?

      • Tracheal

        Actually only 20% of women desire to be Lean In leaders. The other 80% prefer ‘work-life’ balance or stay at home mother-hood. This biological reality is politically incorrect heresy for the alpha gender bigots (feminists) who brainwash us all into buying the Big Lie but happily sexed reality is impervious to ‘gendered’ fantasy.

        • dragon847

          If you have not made them up please cite a source for these percentages as well as the corresponding percentages for men.

    • http://www.dutyfreecritic.com/ Diana

      I agree with your argument partially. From an evolutionary standpoint, women are caregivers. They are not aggressive pack leaders. However, there are always exceptions to this point. And those women are defeminized. Made to feel like a “tomboy” “boy” “not feminine.” Then, there is the cultural influence that you didn’t address. Culturally, it is not encouraged for women to be aggressive really ever. So, couple genetics with culture and you have a society where more women don’t necessarily get their old salary back when they go on paternity leave. They may be less likely to ask for a raise because they don’t want to be seen as unfeminine. And in general, they also are more likely take jobs in the health, journalism, social work, and education fields, which just don’t pay as well (not valued as highly) as engineering, business, and law.

      I made a lot of points that I didn’t heavily research so let me if I have any holes in my argument too.

      • Connor Greenwood – Dean

        I disagree women can be extremely aggressive, look at the lioness in the animal, she is the one that hunts and kills, not the Lion of the pride, she is also a ‘care giver’ being matriarchal in her role of providing for her children. So apply that to a real world scenario where a women is aggressive within her job to provide for who ever, and this is not seen as de-feminising in the slightest, its seen as being powerful in a world where culture and prejudice force the ideals of a women into a box and label it, hence why they are not encouraged to be like the lioness. And as to the remark about the jobs women take Marissa Mayer into consideration, she is the CEO of Yahoo and a computer Engineer as well as a spokes person for google, and education fields are just as highly valued as they consist of teaching the next generation of people who will hopefully relinquish these culture enforced ideals and judge people for who they actually are regardless of gender

        • Joshua Mcclain

          unless i am missing something…humans are not lions. different psychology and anatomy.

        • http://www.dutyfreecritic.com/ Diana

          Actually you know, good point. I didn’t mean to see women can’t be aggressive. I don’t think that’s true. There are aggressive women, but it’s not encouraged. I’m trying to say that the concept started somewhere. It didn’t poof out of thin air. There are aggressive female animals, but you mentioned one. Is that the norm? The point I’m trying to make is that its a combination of society and nature… partially evolution and then society sort of reinforces it to an annoying degree and doesn’t encourage growth and expansion in people. Random tangent but then you said teachers are highly valued? Wait, they are? But teachers are undervalued though. Maybe you personally value teachers, but most of the country doesn’t. I don’t think they get paid for the higher degree they’ve attained and the work (including afterschool hours) they put into their job. I wasn’t talking about professors at universities. I apologize if you included them. And yes you gave one example of a CEO who is a female. I said “that women are more likely to take jobs..” I mean most CEOs are not female.

      • Tracheal

        Biologically women don’t desire to do dangerous, dirty or truly difficult ‘man’s’ work. For more read Moxon’s The Woman Racket or go see Wolf of Wall St. Women are relational animals who sell sex for status whereas men are performance animals who sell status for sex.

    • Jimi Leetmoteev Brxwn

      I don’t think aggressiveness is a necessary trait for becoming a billionaire. In some cases, it can even be a limiting factor. Savviness and diligence, which aren’t gender-specific, are more important. I believe that more women aren’t billionaires because society still places a lot of pressure on women to become wives and mothers at a young age. As a result, women’s personal lives often conflict with their professional goals. If more women were encouraged to pursue their individual interests, instead of being constantly reminded–whether overtly or inadvertently–that they are “designed” to be selfless nurturers, then we would have more female billionaires and more equality within the workforce in general.

      • Ben Lucas

        Jimi – or you could turn it around and society places more emphasis on men being rich and powerful because that is the only way they will be respected by their peers and attract a good mate.

        goes both ways

      • DelPasso

        Take it from someone that has years of experience in the business world and much more knowledge on this subject than you: aggressiveness is absolutely necessary for being a billionaire. You don’t get to have that much money without crushing your competition and probably doing something ridiculously illegal along the way. If savviness and diligence is all it took, most people would be rich.

      • Ben Lucas

        (this is reply to your post awaiting to be moderated which you replied to me)

        I was having this discussion with a friend’s gf the other day. She was adamant that women are exactly equal to men (disregarding the obvious physical differences)

        My question, is aren’t women better then men at some things? Aren’t they generally better communicators, or better carers? It goes back to this old nature vs nurture debate.

        I would argue that there are inherent differences. Men have an X chromosome which effects us biologically in many many ways. More testosterone is just one example. That testosterone then of course effects they way we think and act, which then off course may make us better at some things than others (ie negotiation vs fighting if we are pumped up) to say that the chemicals that are being produced by our bodies does not effect us in some way or another, which then does not have an impact on the way we interact with our outside environment is somewhat counter intuitive in my opinion.

        I know this runs against our progressive culture, but wishing that I had the analytic prowess of Einstein, does not it so. He was genetically different to me.

        Of course, I do believe everyone should just be judged on their actions and potential, regardless of what they are.

        • Jimi Leetmoteev Brxwn

          I think there are differences between men and women that make each sex, on average, more skilled than the other in certain aptitudes, but I think as a society we put too much emphasis on these differences. Many studies show that differences in cebroneural connectivity make men better at motor skills and women better at intuitive thinking. The studies conclude that these differences can be attributed to genetics, but they don’t seem to take into account the effect that learned behavior has on the development of neural networks in the brain.
          Historically, male children have been socialized to engage in activities that showcase their athleticism and leadership capabilities (e.g. sports), while female children are socialized to engage in activities which cultivate their interpersonal skills (e.g. having imaginary tea parties). The phenomenon of pruning removes “weaker” synaptic pathways so that the more dominant ones can be strengthened, which is where the term “If you don’t use it, you’ll lose it” comes from. I would argue that men and women are socially “pruned” through traditional gender roles and this in turn significantly increases the differences in the way men’s and women’s brains are hard-wired. However, I believe that if men and women are encouraged to pursue more well-rounded interests before and during their formative years, then the socialized disparities would diminish and the natural differences would be more readily discernible, which, I hypothesize, wouldn’t be profoundly significant. Progress is being made though. We have more women in this country who are becoming stellar athletes and CEOs, and there’s even been a considerable rise in the number of stay-at-home dads.

          Additional comments

          Let’s not forget that men and women share the same sex hormones; men have a higher proportion of testosterone, while women have higher proportions of estrogen and progesterone. This explains why some men have the capacity to be excellent caregivers/communicators and why some women can succeed in fields that require physical prowess. Both sexes have the same work capabilities, but I think individual interest and personality also play a large role in determining what field one will do well in. By the way, both men and women have X chromosomes. Women have two and men have one. It’s the male Y chromosome that distinguishes men from women.

          Einstein was a brilliant man, but his father, who was an engineer, exposed him to advanced math and science from a young age. His mother, who was a skilled musician, made him take violin lessons, and he actually became quite a virtuosic performer. I bring this up because Einstein talked about how his creativity, more than his intellectual capabilities, influenced the development of his epochal theories. He was naturally gifted, but if his parents hadn’t trained him up the way that they did, someone else’s name would be in the history books. Furthermore, recent studies and books by authors such as Malcolm Gladwell and David Shenk support the view that hard work and sustained, serious practice are just as, if not more, important in developing genius than genetic makeup. So if you want the “analytic prowess of Einstein,” start reading the Theory of Relativity and go from there.

          • Ben Lucas

            First of all, my mistake on the mixup with the chromosomes I admire your faith that we can all be as good at what we choose as each other, though if you think that a normal person with enough study could be as groundbreaking as Einstein, I think you may be reaching a little. Remember that the IQ of 100 is an average, for every person that has an IQ 120, there is another with an IQ of 80 and so forth. Einsteins IQ was 160, therefore there is a person equatable with an IQ of 40. Would that person with enough study produce an advancement into our understanding of the universe?

            It’s a bubbly thought, but one based in naivety of the real world.

            Secondly, historically boys have been taught sports and women to play with dolls? when did you grow up? in the 1800′s? I am 42, and as far as my earliest memories, and girl at school played just as much sports as boys and were encouraged just the same. Granted, they weren’t out playing football – if that is what you mean.

            I have just returned from 5 years in the centre of africa, where most of that part of the world still blames their woes and struggles on the west – a good 50 years after the west has departed. Asia where the same colonization occurred long ago stopped dwelling on the past and look at how successful they have become.

            To understand the causes is one thing, to dwell on them you perpetuate your own weaknesses and start to believe them yourself. Isn’t it time to stop dwelling and blaming all those around you as well as things that happened long ago that never happened to you? Maybe therein lies the issue.

            additional comment: Isaacsons biography on Einstein has been on my reading list for a while. This conversation has inspired me to put it next in line. thanks for that.

          • Jimi Leetmoteev Brxwn

            I don’t think you understood the nuances of my argument. I was basically making the point that if one wants to acquire a certain skill, he or she shouldn’t let their IQ discourage them. IQ tests determine how accurately you can process things within a certain time frame. A person with an IQ of 120 may not be as “quick” as a person with an IQ of 160, but over the course of their life, they could, through deliberate study, produce works than can help advance our collective understanding of the world around us and the universe as a whole. If that weren’t true, then most scholars, whose IQs are on average around 125, should just give up now.

            Drive and self-discipline are more important than IQ. It’s pretty naïve to think that a number produced through a standardized test can define someone’s potential. There are people who are not great at solving analytical problems in timed settings, but if they were in a more relaxed environment and working at their own pace, then they could without a doubt. The key is “Know thyself.” You can only come to know what you are truly capable of through experience. Most people don’t go on to do great things because, despite their intelligence, the “real world” comes with a lot of baggage that weighs them down and prevents them from being successful in certain areas. A person of average intellect can have a profound impact on society through their work if they take stake in themselves and make the sacrifices needed to get that work done. However, because it may take an average person more time to process through their ideas, they may give up due to impatience, perceived impracticality, or social pressures. Bottom line: No, everyone is not destined to be Einstein, but instead of comparing ourselves to others, we should focus on following the goals that we set for ourselves as adults and see what life has in store.

            Also, you may have come from a background where you grew up seeing women actively involved in sports or more assertive activities, but I would argue that your experience strays away from the norm. You are a member of Generation X. Your generation is an anomaly because from the early 1960s to the early 1980s, America went through a significant social revolution in which views on race, gender, sexuality, and religion were questioned in ways that this country hadn’t witnessed before. There are probably a substantial percentage of Generation X-ers whose early lives were impacted by this progress. However, conservative views on gender norms were still predominant during this time period. I would hypothesize then that most people from Generation X were raised more traditionally, which may have had a profound effect on what jobs or careers they chose later on in life. The Baby Boomers, your parents’ generation, grew up during a time where, yes, there were tacit standards for how men and women were supposed to coexist within society. Generally speaking, men weren’t studying to be nurses, and women weren’t studying to become CEOs. Why? Because aside from their aptitude, there were certain institutional norms set in place that discouraged this kind of gender “inversion.” 70% of our workforce is comprised of Baby Boomers and Generation X-ers. Is it so hard to believe that the majority of this 70% were socialized to choose traditional jobs or career paths, and that this in turn contributed to the gender wage gap in this country?

            About the racial/cultural commentary (I don’t even know how that came up), I encourage you to think more critically about the issues that you treaded upon because what you presented was an egregious oversimplification. Colonialism may be over in Africa, but that does not mean that the age of imperialism is. Also, where is the “centre of Africa?” Do you mean the Central African Republic or Central Africa? Africa is comprised of nations and each nation has its own issues. There are commonalities, but I would stray away from lumping them together. In regards to Asia, again, what countries, and even more so, have you spent enough time in them to comprehend what’s actually going on socioculturally? Comparing a whole continent to one area of Africa is unreasonable, especially considering how some Asian countries—particularly those in the Middle East—are far from celebrating in the “Pax Asiatica” that you alluded to.

            Furthermore, I don’t want to downplay the five years that you spent in Africa, but if you didn’t grow up there, you shouldn’t speak on certain affairs. I mean you can, but it’s not wise. As people from the Western world, we need to confront our own biases before we even think to make comments about other cultures. What may be understood as “complaining” in America, may actually be in another culture a form of healthy catharsis.

            Lastly, don’t underestimate the influence that colonialism has had on the collective conscience of certain African societies. There are parts of Africa, especially in West Africa, where women still use toxic skin lighteners because they believe that having a more European appearance will make them more attractive and will thus help them attain upward social mobility. African nation states also weren’t developed organically. Most African nations still have arbitrary colonial borders. When Europeans carved up Africa they definitely didn’t take into account tribal differences. To them, everyone was Black and therefore it didn’t matter if they were all placed into the same marginalized class within geopolitically-problematic land masses, which has since led to brutal sectarian genocides in some countries that have been exacerbated by economic turmoil and administrative corruption. The Central African Republic is on the brink of genocide right now. If people are going around “complaining,” then they have every reason too. They should “complain” even more until the international community at large starts paying more attention to the state of peril that some of these countries are in. The U.N. and certain NGOs can only do so much. The Western nations that contributed to this strife are the same ones that should be offering assistance, less commentary, and more efficacious solutions. I’m pretty sure citizens of the “centre of Africa” want to, at some point, stop dwelling on the past, but did you consider how their present conditions might be adversely affected by it?

            People of privilege make the same kinds of comments about the African-American community. Should we stop talking about the fact that even though African-Americans make up 13% of the overall U.S. population, they constitute nearly half of the prison population? Or should we not lament that, “for the past 50 years, Black unemployment has remained twice the White rate, and at recession levels even when there’s no recession?” Should we keep completely silent about new studies which show that the Black-White academic achievement gap is widening? What would be the goal of getting marginalized people to express their opinions less? To make those of privilege feel more comfortable? What “weaknesses” are being “perpetuated” by speaking out, telling truth, and placing blame where blame is due? If you, as an individual, are working in your own way to promote justice and equality, then you shouldn’t feel slighted by those who choose to exercise their essential human right to free speech by airing their grievances. While I don’t promote finger-pointing or name-calling, I also don’t support the “just-shut-up-and-deal-with-it” mantra when it comes to serious issues regarding race, culture, or ethnicity. The next time you hear someone “complaining” about his or her inherited “woes and struggles,” consider using that as a starting point for a much needed conversation.

          • Ben Lucas

            Jimi – you seem to be a very intelligent and thoughtful person. your arguments are very well laid out and indepth (if not a little long). I do so agree with your not lumping all of africa or asia as one place – that really bugs me, though sometimes we do need to generalize – just as people generalize by lumpiing the west in together as one culture of homogeneous people.

            Indecently, I am from the south pacific and am neither western nor fully white for that matter. I have had to fight hard for everything I have worked for in this world against what seems like a strong current at times. (in reference to your queries – Zambia and Hong Kong for 5 years each along with about 11 other countries I have worked in)

            I have great faith in human kind and our ability to prosper, which at times I have underestimated and at times I have over estimated. The fact lies, that their is still an uneven playing field in ways, but it is a hell of a lot better than it was. The world will never be even in everyones eyes, only in some groups, unfortunately to the detriment of other groups. That’s the way we humans are, and different from when I was (I’m guessing) your age where I believed in everyones ability to achieve anything they wanted, I now believe it is a lot more complicated than that, and dragging everyone down are the victims who instill a blame culture for what is wrong.

            However, that is not to say we shouldn’t stop trying as you say. I’d encourage you to keep your post above and read it in 20 years and see how much of it still applies to those around you and maybe even yourself. Until then, keep up the good work.

          • Jimi Leetmoteev Brxwn

            Thanks for your comments. I appreciate you discussing these issues with me. My responses are so unusually long because I’m writing about this particular post for my blog, so you have been a great help. Take care.

          • Ben Lucas

            My pleasure. If you want to write about something a little more impactful than what toys are in which isles and other first world ‘problems’, may I suggest that some examining or even partaking in reducing some of the global inequalities that exist – such as: http://thinkprogress.org/security/2013/11/19/2924611/angus-deaton-comopolitanism-review/

            As of today, we do not need expert reports by the authoritative analytical institutions to realise that the reasons for such a situation in our community lie in global inequality, poverty and illiteracy.
            Nursultan Nazarbayev

    • Lorra kendal

      First, women don’t take paternity leave. That’s what fathers take. Women take maternity leave. Second, most statistics that address income inequality compare specific jobs. Obviously a man working as a CEO is going to have a larger salary than a woman working as a waitress. That isn’t what people should be upset about. People should be upset that a woman working as an entry level engineer makes 77 cents for every dollar that a male working at the same job makes – and that’s what these statistics show. Your testosterone argument is week too. If that were true, all these billionaires you talk about would be in their 20′s when testosterone levels are higher. In reality I think you’d find most of them are quite past the peak of their “aggressivesness”.

      • Leon Delafonté

        No, they don’t. They compared “the average man” with “the average woman”. They dont control for career choices. Controlled for careers, women earn 94% of what men earn.

        • Lorra kendal

          There are many studies and collections of statistics that show that women make less than men in specific fields. There are also many many studies that take into account differences in types of jobs, family differences, etc. and factor those into the findings. There are certain fields where women make MORE than men for the same job, but for the most part that is not the case. I’d be interested to see who put published the scientific study showing “women make 94%” of what men make.

          http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=5363&page=187

          http://www.jec.senate.gov/public/?a=Files.Serve&File_id=66769080-37f9-4e7a-b2fa-7ac208d9f575

          http://247wallst.com/special-report/2013/11/06/jobs-with-the-widest-pay-gaps-between-men-and-women/2/

          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/21/wage-gap-myth-reasons-to-believe-its-real_n_3478606.html

          • Leon Delafonté

            I can answer your 4 articles with just one youtube video

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwogDPh-Sow

            Here’s a Slate (a pro woman magazine btw) article on the pay gap. It links to a few studies if you’re that detail inclined:

            http://www.slate.com/articles/double_x/doublex/2013/08/gender_pay_gap_the_familiar_line_that_women_make_77_cents_to_every_man_s.html

          • Lorra kendal

            Pretty sure statisticians don’t rely on you tube videos for accurate numbers… if they did they’d all come to the conclusion that our country is mostly made up of cute cats doing funny tricks. I’ve already seen that video. Did you read my articles?

          • anilpetra

            uh hem, it’s a youtube video *by* a statistician.

            egg -> face <- egg

          • Lorra kendal

            Actually I think he’s an economist – which means he’s probably very knowledgeable about statistics. I didn’t argue that he wasn’t. I’m sure he also didn’t gain his knowledge by watching you tube videos. That’s all I’m saying.

            egg -> pan -> omelet

          • anilpetra

            His specialty is econometrics, fool.

          • Lorra kendal

            I don’t understand why you reply to everything I say with an insult. I provided a few links to studies because obviously not everyone was aware of them. Nothing I’ve said has been either mean spirited, clueless, or foolish. . . so not sure why you resort to personal attacks. Care to explain?

          • Leon Delafonté

            What if I told you that video is just as credible a source as articles…crazy right? it’s a fair video that very concise and logically& statistically sound. Not by an MRA group, or conservatives/liberals, or anti feminists. It’s an independent analysis of the facts of the situation by an Economics Professor and Economics author.

            I read your articles. Non of them actually explain why & where the Gender Gap exists. The Huffington post one starts with an article that disproves the wage gap myth (except at the highest executive levels), then goes and sites it’s information from feminist sources who have a vested interest in perpetuating the wage gap myth. It’s a joke.

            The Wall Street one only lists jobs where men earn more. There are plenty of careers where women actually earn more.

            The other two are doing the exact same BS of simply using gross median salary. Not apples to apples. The fact is, a woman faces almost no earning barriers comparable to men in here field if she worked as many hours, never has children & works full time. At worst she might earn 91% of what her guy colleagues earn.

            Now if you want to argue about the 9-2% gap, then maybe you might have a case for sexism.

            Interestingly, my wife is a Project Manager, she does a lot of interviews & hiring. In her 7 years hiring she says that when it comes to negotiating the salaries men always seem to push for higher salaries, they haggle more and she finds she constanly has to go back & forth with HR to negotiate a salary. The women she interviews however always take the salary as advertised (which is obviously always the minimum the company is willing to pay a new hire. And these aren’t regular off the street hires i’m talking about, they’re clinical research professionals with high earning/high responsibility jobs, and the men STILL demand higher salaries.

          • charliemanuel

            Why in the world would anyone rely on Slate for any unbiased information? This wage gap is a complete myth.

          • Leon Delafonté

            Interestingly, it’s an articles in Slate saying that the Wage Gap is a myth. It’s truly something amazing to find factual articles on a site that you’d think would be biased.

          • charliemanuel

            Good point.

          • Tracheal

            Slate, Salon, The Atlantic, the NYT, and many other lame stream news media outlets are totalitarian ‘ministries of information’ which shill bigoted swill for fascist feminists. No credibility is possible from them. Time to demand Constitutional behavior in America.

          • Ida Weber Jørgensen

            I love how all these articles were totally ignored. The wage gap is NOT due to different career choices.

          • Leon Delafonté

            Yes. Yes it is. There is still a wage gap though at 9-2 percent. Is that the one you’re talking about?

      • Christopher L Banacka

        I don’t know about that, where i work the girls make the same as the dudes as eng, but girls get less pay because they don’t work weekends or stay late for overtime…
        Thus they “make less”
        Even though they get the same pay

      • anilpetra

        Your statement that what’s called “entry level engineer” is “the same job” says it all — you are clueless about the modern workplace and workforce.

        • Lorra kendal

          I’m clueless about your statement. Can you clarify what part of the words “entry level engineer” or “the same job” implies to you that I don’t know anything about modern workplaces?

        • Guest

          I’m clueless about your statement. Can you explain what part of the words “entry level engineer” and “same job” implies to you that I don’t understand the modern workplace?

    • http://www.shamontiel.com/ Shamontiel

      1) When a woman is hired for a job, the employer has no idea whether she’s already had the number of kids she wants and never plans to get pregnant or go on maternity leave, the amount of vacation days she’ll use to tend to her family or whether she wants kids at all. I know more women in the workforce (especially in journalism) who don’t want nor have had any children at all so the asinine assumption that they’ll need days for kids is illogical and unfair.

      2) You’re making the assumption that all billionaires earned their money without taking into account that some were born into that money. (And you can’t be born without a woman, just so we’re clear, yet another kudo to womanhood.) Some people depend on daddy to get them to be rich. Others are born into it. And then there are those who earn it the good-old fashioned way.

      3) Women can be as aggressive as men, but women get labeled “bitches” for doing so and men get labeled fun terms like “boss,” “aggressive,” “hard working.”

      4) Beyonce isn’t just talking about billionaires. She’s talking about every single job. While it’s easy to point out the elite, what is the logic in someone working in retail or other lower paying positions and still making less for the exact same amount of work?

      5) At some jobs, men are given maternity leave days. And I say this because I worked at a job where the guy who sat across from me was given several days to be at home with his wife after she gave birth. And it’s not like women are partying and watching TV during maternity leave. That baby depends on her for everything from breast-feeding to cleaning.

  • ou812

    If I could pay a woman 23% less than a man for doing the same work, I’d never hire another man!

    • http://drunkcynic.blogspot.com/ drunkcynic

      Shush, you can’t include facts and economic reasoning in emotional debates.

      • ou812

        Oh sorry, was I mansplaining? :)

        • Tracheal

          No, of course not. You was just stating (anti-feminist) reality. I was simply adding to your point.

      • Tracheal

        or in vile Vagina MONO-logues.

      • hanspy

        Are you saying ”Bosses” have emotions?And they debate?

    • amber

      …. so…. it looks like after reading these comments… you all want Children to grow up in Poverty.

  • mo toons

    So who run the world?? http://youtu.be/p72UqyVPj54

    • pika12

      I’m sure she has family and friends and/or maybe she has been told about the plight of others and wanted to take a stand on their behalf.

    • MizzReyRey .

      so is the music bussiness not a work place to you? u act like she didnt have to work ass to get where she is. you mad cause your still on minimum wage u bum

      • mo toons

        Oh boy, I poked the BeyHive. The music biz is still most definitely a boy’s club, which is why she should sit down and talk to her own husband before she writes something like this.

  • sspistol

    Until some women stop using their sexuality to achieve success then the rest of women will always have an uphill battle to be seen as equals and taken seriously. Yes, I’m looking at you Bey.

    • Aya

      Beyoncé hits home to a – yet mixed – primarily female fanbase and her use of sexuality teaches ownership of one’s body and sexual liberation and empowerment. It’s a sorry society we live in that dictates that women who are secure and unafraid to use their bodies in art are not to be taken seriously.

      • MizzReyRey .

        BRAVO AYA.. Bravo!

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        You’re talking about the woman that makes songs called “I hate boys” and “Who runs the world (Girls)”.

        Would it be “empowering” for a man do make music about hating girls and saying boys run the world? Your answer would be “no”, because you think sexism against men, as a woman “is empowering”, yet think it is intolerable when others do it to women.

        She is a misandrist, as she clearly implies with her song “I hate boys”. If you think that is empowering, then being a misogynist must equally be empowering.

        • SolomonWong

          not how discrimination works, boy

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            Excuse me?

          • Siobhan

            Again, please point us to this “I Hate Boys” song that isn’t just a 30 second youtube clip of some sort of a demo by Christina Aguilera. Kind of jeopardizing your credibility here, son.
            The fact remains that you can cry about “misandrism” as much as you want but people (especially women, as we deal with actual sexim) will have a hard time taking it seriously when this discrimination is solely confined to the internet. You nor any other individual man are not oppressed because women are starting to speak about their life experiences with men as a group. Take a basic sociology course and stop taking things personally. It’s not about YOU.

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            Women face real sexism, as if men don’t? Let me list off a few things. You try and compare the sexism to some sexism women face in the same area.

            - Men were forced to fight, kill, and die against their will due to being drafted. To this day, that can still be pushed on men if government forces it. This is not legal to happen to women. (If you can compare that one alone, then I’d be impressed).

            - Men make up half of the domestic violence victims, however less than ten percent of shelters are for men, nor does the media or any aspect of society focus on them, where as the vast majority of recognition for domestic violence is “male on female” violence.

            - Women receive 40%-60% less prison time for the same crimes as males that commit the same crime.

            - Men have no reproductive rights, regardless of the fact there are methods that would support the idea of financial abortion that would give men equal right to back away the responsibility while the woman still have full choice of her body.

            There’s more, but we’ll keep on those ones, “son”.

            “People, especially women”. Wrong. Do not force representation over women as if you have that right. You speak for feminism, not for women. You don’t get to force representation over women as if they all, or even the majority, agree with you.

            “Take a basic sociology course”, that mixed with women’s studies, right? “Don’t take this personally”. Oh, I know, right? When it comes to sexism, only women suffer from it, despite being the most protected group within society. “Don’t take it so personally. Sexism isn’t about YOU, it’s about ME!” I forget how narcissistic you feminists are in your whole victim complex.

            The fact still remains that most of the problems you as a feminist claim to exist, are not actual cases of sexism. Hell, you’re probably one of those feminists that still believes that the discriminatory wage gap exists, right?

        • http://cynthiabee.com/blog Cynthia Bee

          When did Beyonce make a song called, “I hate boys”?

      • Qaengine

        Nope. Beyonce advances the premise that women are objects. She knows that her body is her best sales pitch (hence the insurance). She is feeding our sex-crazed culture, not by herself, but as one of many women who are given money to sell their bodies under the guise of liberation and empowerment. (How is it liberating to become the toys of men? “Congratulations! You are not a secretary, you are a half naked dancer!”) Then she writes an article about gender equality. She has no credibility on the issue. Her influence is tainted.

        • Siobhan

          Women who show their bodies can’t have opinions about their own worth as humans because a woman’s sexuality reduces her to an object and nothing more, and she has no say in the matter. Got it.

    • Grace Helen

      A woman is free to express her sexuality however she wants. The way she dresses does not affect her worth as a person or her right to success? Stop slut shaming women because it’s pathetic.

  • http://drunkcynic.blogspot.com/ drunkcynic

    The 77% figure is a statistical lie. If you were to consider wages within individual fields, you would notice a parity in salaries.

    • Lorra kendal

      That’s incorrect. Studies take into account individual fields. Women make on average 23% less in the exact same job, doing the exact same tasks that a man making 23% more than her earn. It would probably take you 5 minutes of research to find numerous statistics showing that.

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        No thanks, we’ll stick to the “official” statistics on PayScale that dictates otherwise.

        • Lorra kendal

          You’re going to rely on a statistic that’s validity you question enough that you only include “official” in quotations? Not sure if you’re going for sarcasm or ignorance.

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            PayScale done research on it all, and you can go to check it yourself. I say official because it was “officially” done.

            I know, I know, it doesn’t touch on nearly as much credibility your feminist bloggers have, I know…Wait, yes it does.

            Believing a group with a clear bias over one that doesn’t hold any? Oh how you feminists must have fun in your little heads.

      • http://drunkcynic.blogspot.com/ drunkcynic

        As another respondent stated, if employers could get away with paying women 23% less, then female unemployment would be zero. There would be an economic incentive for employers to women, because they could get 5 female workers in place of 4 male, and more work if individual capabilities are equal. Please cite any statistical study considering men and women within the same field where a wage disparity was found, that is not accounted for by the women voluntarily removing themselves from the workforce to have children. In turn, I’ll reference several that reflect my claim.

        • Lorra kendal

          Not sure I agree with your first statement. Do you think all employers always hire only the cheapest labor all the time? Sometimes maybe. Sometimes they hire who they think (perceive) to be the best employee who will benefit their company the most. And they pay that employee a salary they see fit to keep him .

          I’ve read a lot of articles about the wage gap myth, but if you have one I haven’t read I’d be happy to look at it.

          some studies for you:
          http://www.nap.edu/openbook.ph

          http://www.jec.senate.gov/publ

          http://247wallst.com/special-r

          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/..

          • Ben Lucas

            Lorra – out of interest on the subject I clicked all of those links you give and all just link to a website. not any actual reports or studies there. you mention “Sometimes they hire who they think (perceive) to be the best employee who will benefit their company the most. And they pay that employee a salary they see fit to keep him” therefore implying a perception that the male is the best employee.

            I am gathering from this, you don’t believe that perception is the valid. Would I assume that you might believe this is they root of the problem. Men employing subordinate men, based not upon their qualifications but for some other reason? Care to elaborate?

          • Qaengine

            “Sometimes they hire who they think (perceive) to be the best employee who will benefit their company the most. And they pay that employee a salary they see fit to keep him.”

            Congratulations, you cracked the code! Employers hire people on a case by case basis. They take into account certain attributes like experience, education, and personal qualities and then pay the employee what they are worth based on those criteria. I’ve noticed that, in this discussion, no one is really discussing the experience factor. Perhaps women are only recently breaking into fields that used to be inaccessible. Logically, men would be making a higher wage based on experience because they have been in the field longer. You wouldn’t expect a woman with fewer years of experience to be hired by a company and make as much as all the men who have been working there much longer, would you? Because that wouldn’t be very fair.

            I would like to see a study that looks at entry level positions within one large company. Compare a) number of men applied to number of women applied, b) number of men hired to number or women hired, and c) compare salaries across the board. I would also like other attributes taken into account, such as prior experience, quality of education, etc. Oh, and let’s go ahead and not involve ignorant celebrities like Beyonce.

          • Lorra kendal

            I’ve posted this 3 or 4 times already. This is not by company per say, but it breaks down pay disparity by profession, taking out variables for experience, quality of education, etc.
            (Beyonce was not involved)

            http://www.aauw.org/files/2013/02/graduating-to-a-pay-gap-the-earnings-of-women-and-men-one-year-after-college-graduation.pdf

      • Jean Valjean

        Show us one of these studies. I’ve already seen the Department of Labor study. It just takes the gross income of women and compares it to that of men. That is not a accurate or responsible way of making a statistic.

      • Ben Lucas

        Lorra, if you have the exact facts on this, I would suggest you contact the federal government as this is highly illegal and the companies will be liable for large fines.

        Otherwise in my only 20 years of corporate consulting, not once have I seen a job description that authorizes more payment towards men that women. If anything I see the reverse where companies are mandated NOT to hire qualified men to hire either women or minorities. Let me guess, discriminating against men is fair? Men that had nothing to do with the subjugation of women by other men, long before you or I came onto the scene?

        • Lorra kendal

          I don’t think they need me to contact them as it’s already pretty well understood by the current administration that it exists – which is why the lilly ledbedder fair pay act was recently passed, and why they are working on passing the paycheck fairness act.

          It would be illegal to publish a job description authorizing more pay for men – which is probably why you’ve never seen it.

          I don’t think discrimination against anyone is fair. If I read numerous statistics showing men made less than women, or that one race made less than another (which also happens) I would want to take action to change those things as well.

          • Ben Lucas

            Well if what you say is true and it is based upon people with the same qualifications and experience then that would be obviously wrong. Though I don’t see any fact relating to that here, and quite honestly I have worked all around the world (currently in the BVI) and through my personal experience have never come across this. All the hiring I have done the salary is strictly tied to the job position. Salary can’t be changed per person.

            So discriminiation is certainly wrong, but you do realise that statistics are always going to show disparaties between any group for a multitude of reasons. For instance, color, creed, sex, ethnicity, disabled people, people with lower IQ’s, hippies etc etc. You will forever be taking action.

            As far as I can see, males may earn more on average because we are forced to work. Society will look down on a male if he doesn’t work, have a great job, is successful, pulling in a large salary, driving a flash car, is ultimately successful and able to support a future mate. That seems how we are judged by women – look at any cosmo magazine or GQ magazine for that matter – or anywhere in society. Is that not discrimination as well?

          • Lorra kendal

            Ben,
            Thank you. You might be the only person so far to actually consider things I’ve said and give informed, thought out responses. I’m kind of perplexed at how most people have responded with personal insults – or riduculousness that I didn’t even understand. …

            Obviously it’s a complicated issue. There are I’m sure, many many factors that cause a certain demographic to make less money than another. Maybe it shouldn’t all bother us, but I do think fair to question why it’s happening. And YES. There is also very definitely a double standard on the emphasis we put on men that they have to make a lot of money. If Beyonce had brought that up in an article, and everyone responded by calling it a myth and insulting anyone who disagreed – I’d likewise want to offer some alternative sources of information supporting that.

            Your point on set salaries by position is interesting actually. I wonder how often those are negotiable. Most people I’ve known personally did have some haggle room in employment contracts etc. I’m sure that’s not the case every time though.

            p.s. the first two sites above did link directly to the studies, but doesn’t look like they’re showing up. (might have helped my case if I pasted them in correctly huh?) The huff post article linked to some as well which is why I included it.

          • Ben Lucas

            Lorra – you also have a very proactive approach to the issue and one with an apparent level headed attitude to the complexities involved. I do feel emphatically that a level playing field should be instilled for all and then to let people find their own ways. In doing so some people will pick paths that others will disagree with and that will slant statistics one way or another. Then we can celebrate our diversity which after all is what makes us human.

            Some people seem to lean towards making everyone think and act the same and only then can we only be equal. (most as long as it is their way of thinking) That thought process or eventuality does make me cringe on all levels.

            On the salaries level, I’m sure that there is room for negotiation in many fields. Most of the jobs I have worked in, it is a fixed number tied to the position as previously stated. I’m sure however I would be on the low end if that was not the case – I certainly am not a great negotiator.

  • kcard82

    What qualifies Beyonce to write about the so-called “gender wage gap”?

    • pika12

      She is trying to use her status to help others which is commendable.

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        Help others by using her status to spread a lie that has already been proven to be a lie that will only conclude in women thinking they are treated badly and unfairly in society, thus making them andry and upset when they do not face discrimination with the wage gap?

        Thanks, Beyonce. You help women all over with making them “think” they are treated badly, thus making them angry and sad…..So commendable.

        • JeanbearTheImmasculator

          Found the wife beater.

      • Jean Valjean

        So by inciting hatred of men by pigeonholing us as the wellspring of all women’s problems she is helping us?

        Funny how feminists think they can create equality by ignoring and disregarding the condition and needs of the other half of the population.

        • James

          She absolutely did not solely blame men for this issue. It seems pretty clear that she’s tackling this as institutional discrimination, saying that “these old attitudes are drilled into us from the very beginning,” i.e. neither men nor women are creating the problem. Rather, a culture (the real culprit) in which men have been given the advantage is the problem. We now have the statistics, the scholarly research, the thousands of anecdotes, and the opportunity to finally break out of our current patriarchal society and create a new society in which women and men are both appreciated and loved for what they are in an equal manner.

          If you look back in history, it would be difficult for anyone to find a society that is not patriarchal. Then why is it so shocking that there are still numerous instances of institutional sexism in our country? Have we reached an enlightened age in which injustices are simply incapable of occurring? Of course not. That is not to say that there are no injustices committed against men, but that is not the topic that’s she discussing in this essay and an essay is not obligated to address every topic that is even marginally relevant (that would probably make it a less effective essay, no?). It’s unfortunate that some men (and probably women, too) feel so attacked by the idea of feminism, because a truly beautiful society is entirely possible if people would only listen to each other without preconceived notions and unwarranted aggression.

          It would be great if everyone in this discussion could read a few articles by academics that specialize in gender studies (I don’t actually have any off the top of my head but will start looking for some after this- if anyone else has a few they’d recommend please let me know). I’ve definitely met my fair share of ‘feminists’ that eschew the mission and make it out to be a contest in which women come out with special treatments. However, actual feminist theory is something that everyone should be able to get behind (it’s literally a movement for equality…). That is unless an individual has preexisting prejudices.

          • Jean Valjean

            Show me where she pointed to women’s choices, mistakes, and failures? Did she even mention them? NO.

            It is implied in this article that the fault is men. If Beyonce were to keep on writing it wouldn’t take long for her to mention “patriarchy.” Patriarchy is code for “men.”

            If Beyonce writes an article and says that women are suffering and being discriminated against but she doesn’t mention women as the culprit then who is left to blame?

            MEN.

          • NIk

            How about you show me where she pointed to men’s choices, mistakes and failures. Do not ask for things which your own argument does not provide. Also, you are super defensive for no real reason. The term “patriarchy’ is not code for men. It is a term that represents an archaic institution that negatively affects men and women. Women for obvious reasons and those addressed in countless feminist reporting, but men also because it sets them up to be this emotionless, ultra masculine ideal of a man which is dangerous because the ideal that the “patriarchy” sets up is a complete lie and totally unreachable. A true feminist acknowledges how society and the idea of the patriarchy hurts both men and women. But it is just naive to think that it does not inherently favor one.

        • JeanbearTheImmasculator

          Why do I get the feeling you are are under twenty or over 40 and alone,….

    • MizzReyRey .

      Maybe she actually works first hand with feminism and has met leaders of corporations and knows first hand what they face. What qualifies you to judge a woman’s qualifications that you dont know?

    • Jean Valjean

      Kcard82, she’s a feminist. That qualifies her to speak on all topics regarding female privilege, err, I mean equality.

    • ceruleanblue777

      Advertising revenues.

  • chiangui24

    No disrespect to Beyonce, but she is an uneducated woman, making bold statements about a complicated subject. Gender equality is not the issue in this country. It’s income inequality. If you’re going to talk about gender equality, don’t just focus on women, focus on the men too. She won’t mention that the average income for a man has dropped nearly 28% in the last 40 years. We are all being screwed over equally in the same system, and continuing to argue that women are the victims isn’t smart or helpful.

    • Lorra kendal

      We aren’t being screwed equally. Women make less than men. That’s the opposite of equal.

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        “Women are making less than men, this is gender discrimination!”

        “An engineer is making more than a janitor, this is discrimination!”

        That’s your argument. It’s ridiculous. If women want to get paid the same as men on average, then do the same work as men, on average. You can’t expect to do the least dangerous jobs, the least high paying jobs, work two hours on average less, take leave more, and so on, then expect to get paid on average as a gender the same amount as the opposite gender that does the dangerous and higher paying jobs, that do gravitate towards higher paying jobs, that work two hours on average more, doesn’t take leave as much, and so on.

        You think your gender should get paid on average the same amount as those doing more? No chance.

        • JeanbearTheImmasculator

          You’re an idiot. So by your rational then men in offices should get paid less because they aren’t dangerous jobs. The point she’s making is women aren’t getting paid the equally for same jobs. Nice attempt though. Really. You almost didn’t sound stupid.

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            Derpy derp, de derp. Ofcourse those aren’t the “only” factors, you moron, but expecting an imbecile to come to that conclusion on their own is. What work tends to be “dangerous jobs”, hmm? The jobs that “maintain” civilization to the standard it is at today. So is an “office” worker going to get paid more than someone in construction maintaining civilization? No.

            Not only that, but when I said “Jobs”, I was explaining other aspects in the “same” work area as the woman, so when the man is doing the same job as the woman and has to do certain jobs that may put them at health risk, they will get paid more.

            The fact that you cannot use your mind to fill in the blanks, and in your ignorance and idiocy find a misplaced thought of deserved criticism, shows that not only are you a moron, but you are painfully oblivious to it.

            Nice try. You definitely, from the get go, did sound stupid.

      • Simone

        Lorra, there are more women in the workforce for a reason. Since the whole workplace gender equality thing started, women are getting more jobs. In fact some men stay home while the women work, because it’s easier for a woman to get hired. Maybe that’s because women are willing to take a lower wage.
        My mom has been working as a CNA for a couple years now. When she was hired they offered her $8 an hour and she took it. She now gets paid $9.25 an hour. She does more work that some of co-workers who get paid $10 or more an hour. Her bosses and coworkers love her. Her residents ask for her by name. The point is she took a lower wage, because she needed a job. My dad, on the other hand, works as a musician making between $200-$400 a gig a couple times a month. He refuses to take anything below $200. He doesn’t care if he’s offered $150 for two hours. He feels like he’s worth more than he charges so he won’t budge. He doesn’t care if the power is about to get cut off he won’t do it.
        I personally feel that if you’re doing the same work you should get paid the same per hour. If you’re doing more work that your co-workers (like my mom), you should be paid more than them to. That to me is fair.
        Marcus, I saw in another comment where you said you think the feminist movement should go, because of the “liars and half-truths.” I am a feminist and believe women have come so far, but we still have a little ways to go. There are men out there who believe it doesn’t matter what women think and that men have say so over them. There are men out there believe it is a woman’s job to be obedient. Now before you get the wrong idea, I do not think all men are like this, just a very few. My dad happens to be one of them aswell as a few of his friends that he had talk to me to understand why men are better than women. But I find his reasoning to be stupid and based on how he wants to be treated. He basically wants women to be slaves to men. Believe women were created by God for men and therefore they should do as they are told. He is a huge hypocrit and believes he can do certain things because he is a man, but women can’t do them and shouldn’t because they aren’t women. Says that by wanting gender equality we women are trying to be men.
        I, however, disagree. I believe women and men are eqaully important. One cannot not exist without the other. I believe we all have our parts to play in this world and it is up to us to figure out what it is instead of trying fit a mold. I believe that each woman and each man is different and therefore people should not continue to lump them into groups. If one does something, that doesn’t mean they all do.
        If women wish to be paid more than they shouldn’t settle for anything less. I, like my father, will not take less that what I believe I’m worth. I don’t care how badly I need a job.

      • Christopher L Banacka

        Maybe they should get higher paying jobs…

      • Jean Valjean

        Maybe women should start working in sewers, doing construction, get up on those skyscrapers, load airplanes, work in coal mines and on fishing boats?

        Oh. Don’t want to do that hard dangerous work? Then why should you be paid like you do?

      • chiangui24

        I will let an economist take this one http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/22/the-uncomfortable-truth-about-american-wages/?_r=0
        Given that there were much less women in the workforce 40 years ago, they are doing very well and are now surpassing men on many levels. I think that people just make the mistake of thinking that the traditional role of the male is what everyone should strive for. So a “feminist” will tell women that they still aren’t equal even though there are no longer any institutional roadblocks keeping them from achieving that kind of success (especially with the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act). But the traditional role of women is just as important as the traditional role of men. It is probably in some ways even more preferable considering that going out and working to support your family (as men have been expected to do) keeps you away from them, and even puts your life at risk depending on the job that you’re doing.

    • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSZ55hEkxnM TopBananas

      i’m just curious how you came to the conclusion that she is “an uneducated woman”

      • WronglyRabbit

        She is educated, in music. And she stopped her music education at the high school level, and the very fact that she pulled out the 77% number shows a serious lack of intellectual chops. Sorry, but for the purposes of this conversation she is uneducated, the real crime is that people let her put this out there and embarrass herself and showed this site to have a serious lack of credibility.

    • Ronny Draper

      She isn’t an uneducated woman by the way. If you feel she isn’t educated on this particular subject then say so, but to say she is “uneducated” as in general is not only disrespectful but false.

      • WronglyRabbit

        You are the one putting judgment condition on the statement she is uneducated. By colloquial use and by objective use it is fair she is uneducated. That doesn’t mean anything other than she does have an education. Don’t expand the statement and then criticize people because you took the statement to make other conclusions. Doing so might make you appear… uneducated.

  • Fred Strychnewicz

    Dear Beyonce,

    Stick to performing you idiot.

    • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

      …Could she quit that, too? Do us all a favor.

      • http://2dopesistahs.com/ Da Hype 1

        Who is the “us” to whom you are referring? It most certainly is not the millions of people who buy her music.

        • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

          Just the other millions that don’t.

          • MizzReyRey .

            Well who the fuck are u ppl to tell her to stop performing if u dont pay attention to her anyway. do US a favor and GET OFF THE INTERNET! ignorant prick

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            You do realize that I was joking, right? Or is your need for a catharsis so prominent that you just blow up emotionally over anything, including jokes?

    • MizzReyRey .

      dear fred,
      stick to jacking off to her picture, u idiot

      • Fred Strychnewicz

        Are you opposing my standpoint on her idiocy because you are her fanboy/fangirl, or you actually believe in the bullshit myth about women getting paid less than men?

  • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

    The fact that this “Gender wage gap” myth has already been debunked, yet feminists refuse to acknowledge it as the fact it is, shows that the movement lacks intellectual credibility.

    This is why I am no longer a feminist, the movement is just filled with liars and people stating half truths, too incapable to accept facts that do not work in their favor of how terrible everything is to women, when most of the times it can be refuted.

    Yes, men “on average” “earn” more than women “on average” do. This is not saying men “in the same line of work” earns more on average for the “same work”, it is saying men and women “in general”, in “all” aspects of work and income, are taken in to account, so you have to consider the fact that men gravitate towards jobs that have higher pay, work two hours more, take less leave, do the riskier parts of the job, and so on, all on average compared to females, which is why “on average” men “earn” more for the choices they make, not the sexist attitudes of employers.

    This has been stated for how long now? A year? Two years? How is this “still” a common belief feminists seem to have when the proof has already been shown? It just shows that the movement cannot be trusted, that when it comes to facts, they get to choose if it is valid or not, even if their belief is wrong.

    This is why I am no longer a feminist, why I would never be a feminist again, and why I think the feminist movement has to go. They are unreliable, incapable, have no intellectual credibility, and no intellectual honesty.

    A movement that is convincing women that they are oppressed by indocrinating them with the idea that these myths are true when they have already been debunked, so the people they indocrinate sit there fighting against something non-existent, all while saying “Nothing is changing! See how sexist society is to women!” when the fact is that it won’t change because something that is already at the position you want it to conclude in, yet you believe it isn’t, all they can do is prove that we’ve already made that conclusion, and that isn’t being accepted by feminists…So basically you want “women on average” to get the same pay as “men on average” without pulling in the same work or same type of work as men…Sorry, but no.

    • MizzReyRey .

      Why dont u get out there and actually see first hand the plight that women in america face? i know alot of women who do more than mans day of work, so wtf are u talking about? You are speaking as if women are given equal oppurtunities which we are not. Unless you have a vagina, ur just another speaking about something that you THINK you know or read off the internet.. ignorant. i know first hand that we are NOT equal

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        You may “know” these women in your area, that does not mean this is the case for women in every area. PayScale has already researched this and found that the wage gap exists, but not due to discrimination, rather due to choices men and women make, like I explained.

        Actually, yes, you are given the same opportunities. I can easily turn around and say the exact same to you. “You don’t have a penis, so you don’t know enough about the opportunities men have to compare the opportunities men and women make to come to the conclusion that women have less opportunities”. I can use the exact same reasoning, so don’t go down that road.

        “Read on the internet”. Just because something is online does not mean that it is correct, and like so, does not mean it is incorrect, it depends on the source of the information, in which case the source of this information came for a site with credibility (PayScale).

        Ever think the reason why “you” are not given the same opportunities as others due to your experiences “first hand”, is because of “you” and not “discrimination”? I know how much you feminists like to through the idea that “you” are the problem and like to blame everything on “patriarchy” or “misogyny”, but ever think “you” were the problem, your lacking of skills, education, or just plain ol’ someone was far better at the job than you?

        The only ignorant one here is you, trust me.

        • Carissa G

          I think the idea is that the issue is systemic — the fields that predominantly house men (i.e., engineering, technology, etc) pay better, while the fields which predominantly house women (i.e., teaching, administrative work, etc) tend to pay far less.

          I’m not arguing that those who are engineers or computer programmers should be paid less (their jobs require quite a lot of training/ knowledge/ etc, so the pay should reflect that) — however, we are not doing enough at the elementary, secondary and post-secondary levels to emphasize to females that they too should also pursue those careers. From a young age, young girls are marketed toys that promote household chores, while boys are marketed toys that promote more tactical skills like building, etc.

          Basically, it’s a far more complicated issue than just “go get a better (paying) job” — if it were that easy, then we’d all do it. ;)

          • aaron bone

            I think you are looking at it the wrong way. We can’t determine the wage for a job based on the demographic that is willing to perform it, it must have some greater external factor that determines it’s worth, usually this is supply and demand. If the government bolstered the pay of jobs that are dominated by men then men would go into those fields and we would be even more fucked for STEM fields(which badly need people).

            I have a controversial theory about this so bear with me. Women statistically work jobs with less pay but are more often working jobs that are closer to home, have better conditions and less required OT. To really look at why we have a pay gap I think we should examine what cultural norms encourage men to want to place money first while encourage females to have more balanced lives. The answer to me is that money is closely tied to masculinity in our culture. In the same way that women are told beauty is how they gain power and social status; men are told money is how we gain success. This is why the same magazines that put girls in bikinis put guys in suits.

          • Carissa G

            Hmm… I see what you’re saying and I think it supports the point that I was trying to get across – that certain fields pay better (I like how you correlate that to supply and demand). It just seems to me that there is a trend among the sexes to go into certain career paths.

            I totally agree that we need to examine cultural norms more that encourage males to make more money, and women to live more balanced lives. It seems like it goes back to our hunter/ gatherer days — where men had to hunt (i.e., find food aka make money for the food) and women had to stay home to take care of the household, rear the children, take care of the garden/ farms, etc (i.e., balance the household duties).

            At that time, that made sense — children would die without their mothers (breast milk being the main/ only form of food for infants) so staying home was out of necessity. Now that’s no longer a requirement, but our society still hasn’t quite reflected those changes just yet (not saying there hasn’t been progress — there definitely has been, but studies have shown that mothers who work still do more within the household than their partners; conversely, many companies still don’t offer paternity leave to fathers so even if they wanted the time off to spend with their children, they wouldn’t be able to do it), I just think we have quite a ways to go… and that this argument is a whole lot more complicated than just men making $.23 on the dollar more than women because they are “more qualified”

          • MamaMia

            The thing is men and women are culturally different and they will always be different and will make different choices in general. The most gender neutral countries such as norway and sweden, it is found that 10-11% engineers are women and rest are men and opposite is true in health care jobs.

            Here is the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrsF7wyUxs8&safe=active
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm5mDjxuOKY
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOb1b8GYH6c
            Stop wasting time and resources for social engineering, Stop wasting taxpayers money, my money to bring more women to these disciplines because you can not. They are different and they will always be different.

          • aaron bone

            I don’t check my posts often so sorry this is a bit late. I would say that child rearing is an essential necessity that has been too quickly forgotten in the last 20 years. With pressure from progressives to break gender stereotypes and Eco-Libs to take place in the workforce women have been under a lot of pressure to fill two very big gender roles for some time now. In the meantime there has been no incentive or reward for men to stay at home and/or do what we historically called “women work”. Femenist will say that it’s because we historically place male work above womens work and therefore it’s easy to step up but not down, however would place more on the efforts of feminists to force men to accept women in varying shades of femininity and guys failure to break that stereotype. However either way the net effect is the continued popularity of historically male dominated roles whilst the historically female roles become further incapacitated. I think we need to restore a greater deal of power and respect to these roles, no matter who chooses to fill them, especially teaching.

          • Jean Valjean

            Bollocks. Companies market toys to the gender that is most interested in them. Studies have already shown that when building blocks and trucks are marketed to girls they still prefer dolls.

            You are also ignoring the way the government has reorganized schools to privilege the way girls learn and punish the way boys learn. Despite the free money for girls to get into STEM fields they still aren’t doing it.

            Even the all female colleges and universities don’t offer STEM courses and degree programs. If these universities, whose purpose is to serve women, don’t offer these courses then are they sexist? No. They are a business and they know that if they make the heavy investment in these degree programs not enough women will sign up and they will lose money.

          • Ida Weber Jørgensen

            Government has reorganizied schools to privilege the way girls learn? Where is your proof of that? I see no significant change.
            To me it seems girls are simply beating boys at their own game. Of course that was never going to be appreciated.

          • Tracheal

            School is a tame girls game…in which million of otherwise normal boys are labeled ADHD for being boys (rambunctious) and then drugged to spiritual death by Big Psychiatry/Big Pharma. Besides most schools are totalitarian tyrannies run by and for feminist gender bigots. As Camille Paglia said what we you are watching is a how civilization commits suicide.

          • NIk

            Just..so much wrong in such a small post..

          • Jeff

            Read “The War Against Boys” by Christina Hoff Sommers. It’ll open your eyes.

          • robertfishercalifornia

            Good read!

          • Jean Valjean

            And why is it our responsibility to manipulate young women into doing anything? I thought feminism was about liberating them but people like you want to force them to be just like men.

            Meanwhile, millions of women want to be a wife and mother but can’t figure out how to get the advanced degrees and the career and then have the kids and the husband. Our 50% divorce rate, of which 70% are filed by women testify to the failure of feminism and the unhappiness of women.

          • Carissa G

            Wow! There is no need to get so defensive and accusatory in this discussion. I was merely giving my opinion on a very complex and highly emotional issue.

            I, for one, do not want to “manipulate” anyone into anything or force anyone to do anything. True feminism seeks out equality for ALL. Not women above men, or men above women — liberating society as a whole, so we (read: everyone) no longer have to conform to certain gender norms. No one is forcing anyone to be “like a man,” that statement in-and-of-itself just goes to show how much further we have to go when it comes to equality of the sexes.

            Not sure exactly what you meant, or what your point was, about women wanting to be wives and mothers but being unable to get a degree and career — I think this just goes to show even more so that women are often “forced” to choose between career or family, yet men don’t typically have to choose at all (I would even argue that men don’t think of it as a choice). That in and of itself shows the inequality between genders — it shouldn’t have to be a choice; further, we should place more value as a society in taking care of the household. It is not an easy job!

            I would love to see where you found your statistics on divorce and marketing for toys — I really had no idea, and if that is true as you say, then I would love to read the research and learn more.

            As for the government reorganizing schools to privilege the way girls learn and punish boys, I will have to adamantly disagree. The government is hurting education for all children (i.e., No Child Left Behind) by pushing standardized testing and pass rates to see what students can remember and regurgitate, rather than what they actually learn (knowledge).

            With that said, tl;dr — it’s a complicated issue, but I appreciate that we live in a country where we can have open discussions like this one.

          • Jean Valjean

            You say that feminists want equality for all? Show me any feminist website where they discuss issues in a gender neutral way and advocate for men when men have less or are struggling?

            That’s what I thought.

          • Jean Valjean
          • http://www.themadjewess.com/ The Mad Jewess

            If feminists wanted equality for all, they would not treat men like yesterdays garbage.

          • 24ducksinarow

            Trust me, jean, I wouldn’t put any responsibility for the rearing of my children (male, female, or otherwise) into your hands based on your comments.

          • http://www.themadjewess.com/ The Mad Jewess

            Yep, thats what feminism is: Man hatred.
            The founders of feminism were 2 lesbians that despised men.
            Alice Toklas and Gertrude Stein

          • 24ducksinarow

            Inaccurate. The term is european in origin from the 1870s.

          • Ben Lucas

            Carissa – I heartily agree with your first points. There definitely is a disparity between the jobs that genders are doing which will equate with a wage difference. No where in the first world have I seen since i started working, different wages for men or woman. It is by job description. Whomever meets the requirements for the job, gets paid the rate for the job – regardless of sex. Anything else would be highly illegal and companies would pay huge fines if caught.

            Your second point, however I do take issue with. First of all saying that just because a toy is marketed towards a child, is it not the parent that buys it for them? in most cases the mother in reality? Are you really saying we have no real choice over our actions and we are just the product of marketing? if you are saying that, then I would argue we have a bigger problem in society that would need facing first before we worry what toys our children have.

            Secondly, as a male, regardless of what people market towards me, there is no chance that I will or would have ever wanted to play with a doll set. Or for the matter wanting to do a ‘traditional womens job’ just to make things equal. Encouraging women to do mens jobs I am all for, but forcing men to do jobs they may not want to do, may be the next challenge in equality – good luck in that one. Sounds like a perfect world where men are subjegated into doing things they don’t want to do so we can now be equal. now there is progress.

          • NIk

            What you’re saying is that I don’t think you realize is that men’s jobs are the norm and for women to do them, well that’s equality. But for a man to do a “women’s” job, that’s degrading and a man would have to be forced to. You are placing higher value on jobs that are considered to be for men. Also, the key there is ‘if caught”, just like companies aren’t legally allowed to fire someone if they’re getting older, but we see how that works out too.

          • Ben Lucas

            you’re putting words in my mouth. I never said that one is degrading over the other. I said that I personally and most men, I know have no interest in doing many of those types of job. Just as I have no interest in working in working in mines, or in factories or in garages. I’m sure there are a lot of men who are interested in doing those, but few of the men I know have interest in working in carer or similar traditionally female orientated roles. Though of course some men do. Just because someone isn’t in doing a a certain job, that does not make them a bigot. I would say that since you brought out that a ‘womens job’ is degrading that came directly from your thought process and not mine. Are you aware of the psychological term ‘projection’?

          • ceruleanblue777

            Ridiculous. Women have every opportunity to pursue STEM education and careers. They CHOOSE not to. Did it occur to you that perhaps there are inherent biological differences between men and women that influence the careers that they choose?

            How many women do you know that would choose a career as a miner, or a sewage worker, or a garbage collector, or construction, laying asphalt?

          • Afro Prepper

            “however, we are not doing enough at the elementary, secondary and post-secondary levels to emphasize to females that they too should also pursue those careers”

            WHOA! STOP THE PRESS RIGHT HERE.

            Carissa – I do REMIND YOU that something like 80% of all teachers are WOMEN, white women at that.

            So you tell me who is not encouraging these girls? – what? The men who clearly aren’t there.

            Using your logic I could easily say that black boys are failing because white female teachers aren’t teaching them properly. Makes sense because why would white women want black boys to be able to economically compete with their men?

            [crickets]

        • DelPasso

          You. I like you.

        • clare

          seriously? that is probably the most ignorant thing i have ever heard in my life.

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            What I said? If so, then I don’t work with statements. You either put forward your point and explain or you don’t take part of discussion if you have nothing to offer to it. You won’t be able to push the impression of being correct and I wrong based on mere statements backed with nothing.

          • Steve Corner

            Good, then prove it wrong.

        • http://www.themadjewess.com/ The Mad Jewess

          I applaud your efforts in being courageous enough to tackle the feminist American bullies.

      • Christopher L Banacka

        The only reason you are aren’t equal is because you choose not to be

      • Jean Valjean

        I certainly agree that YOU aren’t equal, but the notion that women don’t have the same opportunities as men is complete bollocks.

        Just because you “feel” like it is so doesn’t make it so.

      • aussieguy64

        I’m calling your bluff. You are a liar.

        You are a Beyonce fan and you will say anything to protect her like a die-hard fan that you are.

        At least be honest that you worship Beyonce.

      • Qaengine

        You don’t need a vagina to be a woman.

        • robertfishercalifornia

          homophobic slur? hahahahahaa

          • Qaengine

            Absolutely not. A statement of Californian fact.

    • Moyra

      The thing here is that even when you account for occupation and industry, education and experience, unions and salary protection women are still paid only 91 cents for every man’s dollar, a gap which increase to 40% 10 to 15 years into their career.

      The 91 cent gap cannot satisfactorily be explained by the choices they make, so how would you go about explaining that? While the 40% increase can be explained by interruptions in a woman’s working life (one that could perhaps be decreased if both partners in a two parent relationship shared the load of child rearing) the only explanation of the former seems to be discrimination.

      CITATIONS: http://www.stanford.edu/group/scspi/_media/pdf/key_issues/gender_research.pdf
      http://freakonomics.com/2010/01/28/superfreakonomics-book-club-goldin-and-katz-on-the-male-female-wage-gap/

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        Men on average work two hours more. Men on average also do riskier parts of the job that would involve risk to health and safety, thus get more income for it.

        • Moyra

          Did you miss the part where I said that even when this is accounted for, there is still an unexplained gap? As that was my entire reply.

          • Mstrx

            Accounting for that brings the difference to 3 cents, not 8

            But then we must account for the fact that men are more aggressive about demanding raises. or that 90 percent of workplace fatalities happen to men

          • dragon847

            100-91=9

          • Ben Lucas

            What is your reasoning Moyra for this unexplained gap? I see a lot of discussions that there is a gap, but few definitive reasons why? maybe that should be what the focus should be on?

          • ceruleanblue777

            When those factors are accounted for, women make 98 cents to the dollar every man makes. So yes, let’s close that two cent gap by all means.

          • MamaMia

            and that two cents gap may not be explained perfectly but it is not because of discrimination and that has also been said again and again.

          • http://www.themadjewess.com/ The Mad Jewess

            When you can piss out a campfire, then you’ll get the same wages.Women are not as strong as men

        • 24ducksinarow

          Again, where are you getting your information from?
          Kindly clarify.

        • http://www.themadjewess.com/ The Mad Jewess

          Women are not as strong as men.
          Case closed.

          • 24ducksinarow

            Strength? I don’t know about that. It takes a great deal of strength to overcome any type of adversity and some life changing events regardless of gender. I recall bearing a child as one of those great feats of strength.

          • Sheryl Eisner Conerly

            The Mad Jewess is obviously also not a Smart Jewess….probably why she’s mad.

          • Speakmymind

            That is not accurate.

      • Shake

        I’d just like to note that its more efficient for a couple to specialize. It’s a fundemental law of economics that specialization is best for all; by having one person raise the children while the other earns the bread it works out best for the child. My mother raised me while my father worked; when I grew up she went off to work raising other kids. It’s a bit disheartening to see kids whom are closer to my mother than their real parents.

        as for your stats, I looked up the Bureau of labor statistics and it varies wildly from profession to profession. Female counselors make more than men, for example. Ultimately you get a clear picture that on AVERAGE women make less but the question is why. Whether its because society sees women as inferior and pays them less or whether its because women dont speak out as much and therefore dont demand raises (and since they dont need them due to men being seen as ”primary” bread winners). I’d say its a mixture of factors, but to say ”no, its because they are hated” is so asinine and simplistic that I can’t accept is as rational. There IS no solid conclusions apart from a few facts:

        -women go into careers that pay less
        -women do take time away for maternity leave
        -the societal view is that men are primary bread winners (you cant legislate away views, btw)
        -the pay gap varies from field to field
        -feminists have a persecution complex

    • Grace Helen

      To say that you are not a fan of some individuals in the feminist movement is one thing, but to say that you are not a feminist is to say that you do not believe that women are equal to men. That’s fucked up.

      • DelPasso

        Feminism is much more than a simple definition. You can absolutely be against the feminist movement and still believe in gender equality.

        • Tracheal

          You can be absolutely for women and still scorn the Big Lie that is ‘gender’ equality but you can’t be anti-feminist and still believe in ‘gendered’ feminism.

        • Grace Helen

          No because the ‘feminist movement’ gets all this shit for being a group of crazy dykes who think women are better than men and should be in control. Being a feminist means believing in the political, social and economic equality of men and women.

      • Ben Lucas

        Woman are not equal to men. Just the same as I am not equal to the guy sitting in the cubacle next to me. He is better than me at some things as I am better than him at others. Men are generally stronger than women. Women are generally better with memory and arguing among many many other things than men. I would say that saying we are equal is naive..

        However, do we have the same access to opportunities as the next person? That is what we are striving for. We’re all in this together. To help others reach their full potential is one of the greatest gifts we can give back.

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        Wrong, and what an ignorant, narcissistic thing to suggest. Get this through your head, as feminists seem to not be able to. You, nor feminism, owns equality. You don’t. You don’t get to dictate that feminism and equality are mutually exclusive.

        Feminism is the belief of equality through “feminist theory”, not simply about “equality”. This means that someone doesn’t have to be a feminist, or even be against feminism, yet not be against equality, as they do not disagree with equality, they disagree with the feminist theory aspect.

        Given that so many feminist theories are proven wrong, yet feminists refuse to let go of using it to give an impression of oppression of women, there is every bit of reason to be against feminism.

        You do not own equality, feminism did not come up with the idea of equality. People can believe in equality and not believe your feminist theory of the issues causing inequality, the issues to overcome to gain equality, and so on.

        Once again, to think feminism “owns” equality is an ignorant, arrogant, and narcissistic thought.

    • NadaAldahleh

      I agree that women are getting paid less because they are “on average” not doing the same work men do. But this is precisely why gender equality is a myth. We raise our women to be less ambitious than our men.

      For example, we often see wives sacrificing their own careers for their husbands (e.g. by moving countries), but we seldom see the opposite. I hope one day we’ll have a society that is truly equal. A society where statistically # of stay home moms is equal to # of stay home dads. # of women in executive roles is equal to # of men in executive roles…etc.

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        You have to consider the extremely possible fact that these women choose to give up their jobs so that the man works. I remember seeing an article explaining how most women would prefer being a stay at home mom as opposed to a worker.

        It isn’t that women are brought up with less ambition, it could well be that men are just programmed to have more due to biology, given the hunter and gatherer differences in the genders.

        I’m sorry, but thinking that because the gender statistics in each aspect of life are not equal somehow equals to those aspects of life being due to sexist reasons of some kind is preposterous. You can’t have 50/50 in every aspect of life because men and women are different. People seem to think that the differences between men and women stop at neck and up, it doesn’t. Men and women like different things, our biology fits in with different things.

        You can’t claim that sexism is the cause of every aspect not being 50/50. That’s like saying the olympics are racist because the races are all of black people, which is not the case it’s due to those men being the fastest.

        • NadaAldahleh

          Roles of men and women through history and across cultures varied a lot. To think that the western culture in the present time has it all figured out is a bit narrow minded.

          There are differences between men and women, but how much they should contribute to our economy is not one of them. To say “women in the workforce can do less than men” is sexist. Just like in the early 1900s when people used to say “Blacks have smaller brains and are therefore inferior to whites” was racist.

          PS. I understand women who stay at home are doing it by choice. It’s still sexist that our society produces more women who want to stay at home than men who want to stay at home.

          • Ben Lucas

            still sexist that “society” produces? Do you really have such a low opinion of peoples free thought and self determination? If women do something you don’t agree with, then society (ie men) is forcing them, and let me guess… if they do do something you agree with then they have made a right choice given to them.

            you really should stop having such a low opinion of women intelligence and their right to choose.

          • NadaAldahleh

            We are all a product of our society and upbringing. Neither men nor women are to blame. We should all work together to move our society forward.

          • Ben Lucas

            We are all a product of our experiences, thoughts and actions as well as what we are taught. I think you put too much weight on what people tell you and too little on your ability to make your own decisions. You might like to think about that.

            People grow through experience if they meet life honestly and courageously. This is how character is built.
            Eleanor Roosevelt

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            To say that it is sexist to say one gender is better than another in certain aspects of the workforce is narrow minded.

            Consider mining, construction, fire department, and so many other examples of jobs required to maintain and protect. These jobs require strength, and men have a biological advantage due to being stronger, and so they are better at those jobs than women.

          • NadaAldahleh

            Again you are twisting my words. I didn’t say “it is sexist to say one gender is better than another in certain aspects of the workforce”. I said “it is sexist to say one gender is better than another in the workforce”. As in it is sexist to say men should earn ’on average’ more than women, because they are ‘on average’ better than women in the workforce.

            Also, men are earning more than women not because of jobs that rely on strength. They are earning more than women because they are more likely to reach high-level executive jobs, and top positions in the corporate world. These jobs do not rely on biological strength or any male gender advantage.

            There is ample evidence that when women are able to develop their full labor market potential, there can be significant macroeconomic gains. One day when we reach this level of equality, the world will be a better place to live in for both men and women.

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            Well, I assumed differently and thought that’s what you meant. I apologize.

            That being said, the vast majority don’t say that men should earn more in the workforce becasue of their gender, but that men simply earn more on average because of the work they do, and should be paid more for doing more, as should anyone, not that they should get paid more for being male, which doesn’t happen.

            Actually, that is incorrect. I may play as “part” of the reason, however the largest reason is a collection of choices made by men, the main important one being men gravitate towards higher paying jobs than women do as women tend to not enjoy those types of jobs, such as engineering, construction, and so on, all jobs that are not high-level executive jobs.

    • 24ducksinarow

      Rational thinking begins and ends when one can and will support her or his viewpoint(s) with a credible source or sources. Logically, this is due to that fact that we all have opinions. You mention “the facts” in your statement above and offer the idea that you are no longer a feminist because of what you believe are fact-based viewpoints assumedly based on some type of gender neutral information that is present.

      My only question is what gender neutral sources are you reading/watching that support your opinions? I’d like to read them assuming they aren’t (again to reiterate) from some type of propaganda group. If they are, understand that no person can, will, or logically should fall into the articulate banter you’ve thus far posited as your own version of fact.

      Regards.

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        Proof in regards to what subject? The comment you responded to was about feminism and that it is not needed to believe in equality, which it isn’t, so I assume you are meaning another issue I have mentioned somewhere else.
        Care to elaborate?

    • http://www.themadjewess.com/ The Mad Jewess

      This is because feminists in America are insane. They pretend to be oppressed.
      Meanwhile, in the Saudi lands, women are beaten, chopped up, set on fire, stoned, etc..
      These American feminist gasbags care nothing for women at all. It’s just about man-hatred and penis envy.

    • jazz

      The fact that you don’t know the definition of a feminist, makes it hard to take your post serious. A feminist- someone who believes in equality between the sexes. PERIOD. and that is a belief, if genuine, can never escape you.. Regardless of hypocrites

      • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

        The fact that you are a simpleton and can’t rationalize makes your response hard to take seriously. A feminist is someone that believes in equality through “feminist theory”, hence when someone identifies as a feminist, they believe in feminist theories. If feminism was simply “believing in equality”, then there would be no need for a second words to mean “equality”.
        Have you met a single person that doesn’t agree with feminist theory yet believes in equality and consideres themselves a feminist? No, because that doesn’t happen. Being a feminist is believing that the genders should be equal through the lens of feminist theory, the issues feminist theories consider to be issues, and how to over come those issues.

        How narcissistic you feminists are to think you can just “take” a work and brand your initials in to it and say “if you agree with this, then you are that”. No, sorry, you don’t “own” the idea of equality, and you’d be best to get your egotistical, self-righteous mind around that.

        So no, it is not as “simple as that”. You don’t get to force your label on a fucking word just because you think “this is mine because I said so”.

        You can be for equality and not be a feminist due to not believing in the feminist theory that “established” the feminist movement.

        You lot are the most narcissistic/arrogant people I have ever come across, I swear. To think I was one of them.

        • jazz

          A Simpleton.. Awh thats cute.. Do you own a dictionary Marcus? Because it sounds like your facts are either coming from thin air or from a group of people that have truly absorbed the stereotype of what a “Feminist” is..( bra burning, men hating, grizzly dyke looking women)
          I have included a link for the definition of Feminism.
          http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/feminism.. So that you may enlighten yourself..I’m sorry if a group of women seeking equality rubbed you the wrong way to the point you want to vomit inaccurate info on an uplifting article. But in a Patriarchal society ( Male centered). When feminists are seeking equality it may seem that we are putting down the male gender but in actuality we are uplifting our own, so that we may have the same luxuries that men are born with.

          And please do not allow stereotypical feminist turn you away from promoting equality.. regardless of the cause: gender, race, sexual orientation, religion or.. whatever. You turning your nose up at causes that promote equality .. is the same as you turning your nose up all fitness centers because, you once went to a gym with a bunch of douche bags… You are only stunting your own personal growth

          • Marcus Anderson-Smythe

            The dictionary definition of the word is extremely vague. Yes, it is about equality, however it is under the idea of equality under “feminist theory”. Can you be a feminist without believing in feminist theory? No. So that means that to be a feminist, you have to believe in feminist theory, and if you are a feminist that believes in equality, then you believe in equality through the lens of feminist theories.
            You’re that type of person that takes things as face value, you see something written and think that is all it is, you can’t think outside the box or use deductive reasoning to come to the accurate conclusion if the box doesn’t show you the way.

            “Feminist stereotypes”. Many feminists fall under each of those stereotypes, however they also all fall under the title of idiots that support an ideology that blames men for every problem while claiming “We don’t hate men, we just blame you for all the bad things in society”. Good one. No, I don’t care if you’re either of those things as a feminist, they’re idiots nontheless.

            “Feminism” is a group with “literature”. You can’t be a “feminist” without agreeing with their literature unless you are a pseudo-feminist. Since literature is involved, so are theories. Those theories can be proven wrong.

            For example, I will show the idiocy and way you are trying to prove your point on religion: “the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.”
            That contradicts the religion of Satanism that is about individuality and seeing yourself as the ruler of yourself, not as a God.
            Understand? Vague descriptions are vague…….Not hard to comprehend.

            “I’m sorry if a group of women seeking equality rubbed you the wrong way
            to the point you want to vomit inaccurate info on an uplifting article”

            Again, all you can work with is sarcasm. Can you use reason? You know, the think people of intellect use, or are you simply only capable of sarcasm as a means to escape having to actually demonstrate your point? Ever hear the whole “Sarcasm is evident of a loss”?

            No, “a group of women seeking equality” does not rub me in the wrong way, infact I know a few that do, frequently listen to a few, and you know what they all have in common besides using facts and reason rather than lies and emotions? They’re not feminists. So no, women seeking equality, I’m all good for. Feminists that think only women suffer inequality when most of the issues they bring up are lies or half truths, no, I don’t like that.

            “But in a Patriarchal society ( Male centered). When feminists are
            seeking equality it may seem that we are putting down the male gender
            but in actuality we are uplifting our own, so that we may have the same
            luxuries that men are born with.”

            Oh, here is it. Poor mimminz (what I call women when they are doing the whole “poor me” routine.
            I tell you what, K, hun? I’ll list off a few disparities between the genders, you then list the ones you know of, and then we’ll see who society is “centred” around, ok? Now don’t get me wrong, I know how this is going to play out, you feminists are predictable. I will list my things, and you will most likely A) List lies through feminist theories, not facts, B) Make some BS excuse not to respond (because you know you can’t and are too arrogant to concede).

            Disparities in favor of women and against men:
            - Men can be drafted. Men were made to fight, kill, and die against their will in war, women weren’t. Soon after, men got the right to vote. Men got to vote for protecting and dying for their country. Fastforward ten years, women protest against that country men died for to get the vote, all so they (women) could vote like men.
            Men had to sacrifice for their country to vote, women had to protest their country to vote. Tell me, who had it harder in gaining the right to vote, hmm?
            Regardless, men, to this day, can still be drafted. If government demands, men can be forced to fight, kill, and die against their will like the did in the past. Women, to this day, cannot.

            You go ahead and bring me “one” issue that compared to that which women have to face. I dare you.

            - Despite domestic violence studies showing men and women are equally victims, less than 10% of shelters are for men (Oh, that patriarchy. Male centered, right?)

            - Despite men being the majority of the homeless, there are more programmes for homeless women (Again, so male centered. I mean, how society protects women and leaves men out in the dirt? Must be that male privilege I hear you fems talk about so much).

            - Reproductive rights. Despite there being methods to ensure men get equal reproductive rights (the equivalent of abortion) without it conflicting with the woman’s right to choose over her body, men still do not get that right.

            - Male circumcision. Female circumcision is illegal, yet male circumcision is still common practice. Get that. In this “male dominated society”, it is illegal to mutilate a female child at birth, yet acceptable to do it to a male child.

            - Women, on average, get 40%-60% less prison time for the same crimes under the same circumstances as men committing that crime. (Male centred, I know, right? Giving us that free holiday in a dangerous environment. How privileged)

            - Men, on average, make the majority of violent crime victims, yet “VAWA” the “Violence against women act”, women being the “minority” of violent crimes, happened. (Our society is male centred and favors men…That’s why we ignore the majority of violent crime victims due to them being male and make new acts for the minority of violent crime victims because they are women).

            The list goes on and on, there are many more. This is that “male centered” society you speak of. These are those “luxuries” that men have.

            But go ahead, your turn. You make a list of the “luxuries” men have that women don’t, the inequality and unfair treatment in response that favors men over women in society.

            No, it’s people that you that made me leave feminism, that along side how wrong their theories were. People like you made me actually go out and look everything up myself rather than relying on other feminists to tell me what’s what.
            The fact that you think society is “male centered” when all these things I listed happened, how women are protected by society far more than men, that’s why I oppose the ideology that states the opposite is true.

            But oh, please do bring me that list. I want to hear this “Privilege” I apparently have due to simply being male and all the luxuries that come with it.

  • kingofswing3000

    Not true, Beyonce. Not true.

    • MizzReyRey .

      You’re fucking stupid. do ur research

      • Jean Valjean

        Keep henpecking those lies. All you are doing is destroying the credibility of feminism and revealing it to be a vapid theology of bigotry.

      • ra44mr2

        Yes i am sure someone named MizzReyRey is a bastion of intelligence and wisdom that has multiple PH Ds in statistics and sociology. Yea im sure you have done loads of research beyond asking your fellow fast food workers if they make less than men.

  • YanniYohnson

    I think women should be treated as second class citizens because that’s how men are treated. Example: Draft, domestic violence divorce law….. ect.

    • JeanbearTheImmasculator

      There is no Draft for starters…. So yeah.

      • ra44mr2

        No but men have to sign for selective service in case there IS a draft. Do women have to do the same? You dont really have to answer because i know I already know. the question is do YOU.

      • YanniYohnson

        It’s called selective service….. So yeah. I don’t expect you to know what service is.

      • YanniYohnson

        I also don’t expect you to understand why women get paid less. Might be because we aren’t comparing male teachers to female teachers we are comparing male engineers to female teachers. Why do I expect you voted for Obama?

    • Grace Helen

      …………..are you serious? Men are not treated like second class citizens because of domestic violence. Any man who acts out in violence against a woman shouldn’t even be considered a citizen. So what if men have to sign up for the selective service, there’s no threat of a draft anytime soon. Also, plenty of woman would sign up. It’s a fact that women are treated like second class citizens. Teenage girls who were raped are slut shamed and accused of ruining their rapist’s lives. We are told that the way we dress makes us accountable, it’s our fault. So why don’t you grow up and recognize that woman are still being oppressed in this country?

      • YanniYohnson

        No women is oppressed in this country by the government or by corporations. You can not give an example of either and never will be able to. Slut shaming is done to females by other females as well and done more female to female than male to female. Females judge and talk down on other females way more than any man ever would. Domestic violence cases no matter who hits who or if no one gets hit the man is always arrested and spends the night in jail. THIS ISSUE WITH DOMESTIC VIOLENCE IS ALWAYS THE CASE. We don’t need a threat of a war to go to war tomorrow. The fact that women get the same rights as men and don’t need to sign up for selective service is at best insulting. You want your equality? are you willing to die for it? Let me answer that for you, No. You want equality that’s fine, next time a girl hits me I will make sure she is spitting up teeth in the name of equality. The reality is Women don’t want equality they want to be equal on their terms. They want the same pay, men to open up doors for you and men to pay the check when it comes to the table but they don’t want to be treated the same in the eyes of the law or when it comes to serving ones country. Imagine you slap/punch a man. No real man would hit you back knowing that you are not and never will be physically equal nor mentally. Mentally equal in that you didn’t recognize his clear superiority from a physical aspect. Now imagine you punch/slap him and he punches you in the face. You spend a week in the hospital and your jaw is wired shut. If a man did this to a man no biggie it was self defense ect ect. If a man did it to a women the man goes to jail you sue what ever. In a world with equality amongst the sexes women don’t get the sue and it would be deemed self defense. The true reality of how physically inferior you really are can be shown in the Olympics where the slowest male runner is over 2 seconds faster than the fastest female runner. Your mental inferiority could be found in the fact that if all men were to disappear tomorrow humanity would exist until the check engine light came on or you needed a oil change. If all women disappeared tomorrow men would figure out a way to carry on the species and be a little upset and that would be it. Females are not treated as inferiors even though they are extremely inferior because men don’t care about shit like this. You are treated as equals even though you are not even close. You don’t need to except this fact but remember men may act like they give a fuck but men posses this amazing power of truly not giving a flying fuck. I may say to my girl friend yea you look good in that dress but the reality is all men don’t give a fuck.

      • YanniYohnson

        Remember man has invented make up (most likely) so you can feed your ego. Take into consideration that if you are a man and born ugly you are fucked. (another example to how much men don’t give a fuck about what what women think)

  • Van Chandler

    http://youtu.be/EwogDPh-Sow

    End of discussion.

  • Brian

    Wonder how Beyonce found time to write articles about gender equality, what with her busy schedule of putting on latex body suits and gyrating her ass to the delight of masturbating men everywhere. We need to take a stand on equal wages, ladies! Now watch me grind this pole!

    • MizzReyRey .

      better like Watch me perform for the president TWICE! & the superbowl # watch me win the ASCAP award AND watch me get praise from Nelson Mandela. wtf have u been doing?

      • Qaengine

        Oh, I see now! So the goal of feminism is to gain the approval of men in power. Well, Beyonce’s method of female objectification will do the trick.

  • Michael Horsman

    The only myth here is this tired old wage gap myth, lies, moral panics and myths of oppression, that’s feminism.

  • James

    Queen B needs to read a lil

  • Brian Hopgood

    Yet another load of BS coming from the mouth of a feminist. Why are feminists such liars ?

  • Christopher L Banacka

    Maybe women should get jobs that pay more, and be willing to work weekends and overtime pay. And get jobs that pay better.

  • Christopher L Banacka

    Remember who she is dating, she isn’t too smart….

    Actually i would vote her as rather dumb.

    • Padmini

      I dunno bro, her “dumb” husband referenced the Euthyphro in one of his songs…

  • Leon Delafonté

    She needs to stick to singing, because she has no idea what she’s talking about. You can’t compare engineers to nurses and scream sexism for their lower average pay. Career by career women actually earn 94% what men in the same field/job earn. In fact, childless older women in the workforce have actually been shown to earn 113% more than their peers in their field.

    The sexist gender wage gap is a Myth!

  • Jean Valjean

    Oh look more feminists pretending to understand statistics and making generalizations about wages in the US.

    The fact is that when feminists compile their income inequality propaganda they only look at two categories: women and men.

    What they don’t look at is women and men in the same field. They don’t look at how many hours a week each gender works; whether they work nights, weekends, or outside in the weather. They don’t take into consideration that men make up the majority of death professions and that almost all jobs involving science, technology, engineering, and math are occupied by men.

    Bigots like Beyonce Knowles want you to believe that women aren’t getting a fair shake. She looks at studies that compile only the gross income of women and compares that to the gross income of men. She is unconcerned whether the women work in the same fields, have less experience, or take more time off from work. Nor does she want to mention that billions of dollars are transferred from men to women in the form of alimony and child support every year, or the billions of dollars in grants, welfare, food stamps, health care, etc. given to women to subsidize their lives. She wants to sell you a lie so you will believe that women are victims.

    And most importantly, Beyonce Knowles wants to absolve women of any responsibility or accountability for the choices in their lives. Beyonce, like many other feminist bigots wants you to believe that women never make mistakes and that all their problems are men’s fault. That women’s choices to make babies before they can support them and before they are in a binding relationship has nothing to do with the fact that women make up the majority of fast food workers and other low wage unskilled labor. And that there is absolutely nothing we can do to improve their condition except to spend billions subsidizing their bad choices.

    Had Beyonce told the truth she would have said that when accounting for all the above factors (except child support and alimony) women make almost exactly what men make and young unmarried women actually make more than males of the same cohort. But when alimony and child support are factored in women make considerably more.

    Beyonce is a liar and a bigot who wants to divide people and perpetuate a feminist welfare agenda that is fueled by anger which she is attempting to incite.

    Don’t believe me? Do your own research. Read the studies that the department of labor put out and look at their methodology. Even they don’t factor in for the above criteria.

  • Ronald Patrick Marriott

    I have a new energy discovery to change mankind. I’d rather have a woman working in leadership rolls in my corporation. The world needs a chage.

  • Jean Valjean

    I am really heartened to see that so many people no longer believe this feminist propaganda. These misandrists need to be shunned and ridiculed for continuing this kind of false and hateful propaganda.

  • Jim

    Thomas Sowell dissected this argument years ago, it’s a myth.

    • StubbornlyRational

      Jim, Warren Farrell wrote a whole book about it, and the Independent Women’s Forum in Washington D.C. had an extensive expose as well.

  • Randy L

    We must demand that people, like Beyonce, pay more in taxes due to the minimal value of what they produce in relation to what they earn. 80% sounds fair.No one deserves $50 million dollars for singing songs.

    • Jean Valjean

      You make a very good point. Perhaps we should charge women in general and feminists like Beyonce in particular more in taxes so they can help other women make up the difference? Since this is an issue that is important to them and they feel that women need help then perhaps they should put their money where their mouth is?

      Perhaps Beyonce wouldn’t mind forking over much of your income to support single moms who make less because they work at McDonalds?

    • http://www.pmurraymusic.com/ P. Murray

      To be completely fair, she has built her brand as a multi-faceted entertainer. While she does receive mechanical royalties from her co-writing ventures, as well as basic artist royalties for moving product on behalf of a larger organization (i.e. contracted artist on a record label, which is still cents on the dollar, I assure you), I’d argue that at this point, the majority of her income is based in non-musical business ventures, and the earnings that do come from any current musical endeavors are more than likely due to her strenuous live performance and touring schedule. It is true that entertainers who reach the echelon of superstardom at which she finds herself now make exorbitantly disproportionate amounts of money, but when you stop looking at it as one woman “undeservedly” making said money, and start looking at it as a female entrepreneur and CEO of her brand/company – one who has openly admitted that she is now the majority financier of her career – it’s less of an astounding thing for a “singer” like Beyoncé to pull in the kind of earnings she does.

      And, on a personal note, as a[n aspiring???] singer/writer/producer in Pop music, taking into account that most talented individuals never get the chance to touch the coattails of Beyoncé’s success, I’ve no problem with any artist making $2,500, or $250,000 for “singing songs,” let alone $50M. What we think she deserves or doesn’t deserve is not for you or I to judge or condemn. If someone works hard at their craft, puts in the time/effort, build a team of people to achieve their goals, is willing to compromise their specific ideas for a bigger picture, and do all of this while being under the constant scrutiny of the American Court of Public Opinion, I say let them reap the benefits.

      • Qaengine

        Those non-musical business ventures being make-up ads? Yeah, still perpetuating the problem.

        • http://www.pmurraymusic.com/ P. Murray

          The problem of being successful on different levels of advertising and marketing? What problem, exactly, does that perpetuate?

  • Bill

    The minute that the incarceration rate of this country becomes equal between men and women is the minute I’ll start to worry about wages becoming equal between the two. Until then, don’t expect any help from me.

  • Silvermane

    For God’s sake, please stop spreading that B.S. statistic! I love Beyonce as a singer, but she is clearly just regurgitating propaganda without even checking basic facts. So I will tap my foot to her music, but I will go elsewhere for advice on gender relations.

  • MCUOfficial

    “Humanity requires both men and women, and we are equally important and need one another. ”

    More feminist nonsense. Absolutely clueless to the basic laws of supply and demand. No, they are not equally important. Women have the scarce supply in the reproductive market (400 eggs per lifetime versus trillions of sperm) and the additional investment (9 months vs 10 minutes), which gives them less room for error. They are thus more picky in their choice of a mate. Men compete, women choose. True in all animal species, including ours. A competitive drive immediately becomes advantageous for a man, and natural selection takes cares of the rest. Welcome to 200,000 years of human mating. Nobody cares about a woman’s achievements; her value is determined by her youth and beauty, which we subconsciously recognize as indicators of fertility (sorry to burst the patriarchy bubble). A man’s value is a lot more fluid — he can establish himself with wealth, intellect, provision of resources, social dominance etc — because he is required to be competitive to stand out among the other men.

  • Jeff Schind

    Lol. You guys are not making any valid arguments. I work as a resident in OBGYN and I can for sure say that gender equality still doesn’t exist. For example, my female resident, who accidentally snips the ovarian artery gets a load of shit and crap handed to her for a mistake. If I do it, as a male, I get the whole, “Oh, you didn’t see where you were! Just a little mistake! You’ll know better next time!” These comments are even uttered by the female attendings. As a male and feminist, I can honestly say I see this shit all day long. Even though I get the brighter end of the stick, I get angry that my female residents get more shit because I’m the 1/3 males in a class 32 women. Remember, it’s not all money. Equality has to span all spectrums.

    • http://theseonut.com/ Adam

      To the contrary. All companies I’ve been in, women are often treated better than men with a higher level of respect. I’m being serious. Especially in executive level positions. Just because you you’re seeing it doesn’t mean it’s a reality everywhere.

    • StubbornlyRational

      Jeff, does your supervisor know that you are posting anecdotal observations and touting them as if they had any value whatsoever as experimental evidence? As a research scientist with about 9,000 citations to my name, I can say that you need to take a course in experimental design.

      • ra44mr2

        Stubborn i would BET your assertion that he is a hustler is ABSOLUTELY spot on. I have found (and yes its anecdotal :p) that the men that scream the loudest about womens rights etc are the ones that will say anything to get them in bed and then walk away all the time telling them how they are strong women and they dont need him. So typically its to get laid. After all people that tell the truth are the ones that are disliked the most so its easier to lie to people to make yourself look good.

        • Jeff Schind

          Oh YES! You all figured it out! I’m a hustler that is a homosexual. I love to trick women into bed so I can have absolutely no interest in sleeping with them just so I can out loud, “I’m a feminist!” While my program size might be considered a small population; many other male obgyns that I meet at conferences all talk about that. Yes, the female obgyn residents are also aware of this and laugh about it all the time. Male doctors in OBGYN are the golden gooses of the program because obgyn is predominantly female driven and directors try to recruit men to diversify. My supervisors give negative two fucks about my observations because A) It doesn’t affect them B) we’re human and if you don’t have the capacity to make observations then you should probably check your pulse.

      • Mstrx

        A better term for men like that is: MANGINA

      • Jeff Schind

        Oh, and good for you and your 9000 citations. I understand p values, significant data and non significant data. I also have been a part of nearly 20 medical articles dealing with obstetrics. I’m talking from my own observations, female residents and programs that span this great ole USA. So, I will repeat myself, gender equality does NOT exist.

    • Qaengine

      Dude, the medical field is messed up. There might be gender issues, but I would be more worried about the old vs. new doctors problem where they treat you guys like whale poop. There is so much wrong with the sociology of practicing medicine, I don’t think you should be using it as a relevant example in this discussion.

  • Logic_Logic_Logic

    I guess nobody told Beyonce the “a woman earns only 77% of what a man does for equal work” nonsense simply isn’t true. Of course that misnomer will continue to exist forever since the media will never report anything that isn’t pro-female.

  • PD

    How convenient that this is written by a greedy multimillionaire who hasn’t worked a real job in her life. But hey lets jump on the feminism band wagon, that will definitely sell more albums!. I wonder what the collective stats are on feminists attending empowerment concerts compared to the general population.

    Ps. whenever I hear the word “equal respect” it always comes from someone who wants everyone to change to their views and ideals. Totally weird how that works

  • Greg

    Beyonce might have very noble aspirations for gender equality in the
    future, but talk is cheap. Being currently ranked 7th on Forbes “Most
    Powerful Women” list and with an estimated net worth of $350 million,
    you’d think she could do more than just write an essay to promote
    women’s rights or am I missing something? Social dialogue is important,
    but change requires action. She personally earns more money than 99% of
    American males, so rather than merely criticize the free market, why
    doesn’t she do her part to personally redistribute her wealth to
    underpaid and disadvantged women? Wouldn’t you if you had that much
    money? Imagine how much more progress could have been made if someone
    like Susan B Anthony had Beyonce’s resources today. One thing I’m sure
    about is this article will no doubt improve Beyonce’s public image
    concerning women’s rights, but not much else…

  • Ben Lucas

    One of the articles just above the comment section explains the gap highlighted throughout here all by itself:

    - The average woman continues to be paid 77 cents for every dollar the average man earns. The average African American woman earns only 64 cents and the average Latina only 55 cents compared to white men.
    - Women are nearly two-thirds of minimum-wage workers, and a vast majority of these workers receive no paid sick days. Not one.

    The AVERAGE woman continues to be paid 77 cents on the dollar the AVERAGE man earns then continues to say that women are nearly two thirds of minimum wage workers. Ergo, the average wage is being brought down by more minimum wage workers.

    The real question would be – why are there more female minimum wage workers? Lack of access to quality education? No, this is not the taliban – women have equal access to education, unless white men are holding them back at that as well.

    what then is the reason? spit it out.

  • Saul Campion

    Marcus Anderson-Smythe. You are taking a standpoint that is harrowingly similar to that of a men’s rights activist, and in case you don’t know, MRA’s have no credibility what so ever.
    Misandry exists, I will accept that. Is it dangerous, or at all a problem? Not really, no.
    Men are conditioned from birth to strive for masculinity, which means that they view anything feminine (women, LGBTI people) as lesser. If a man made a song called ‘Who Runs The World (Boys)’ it would be disgusting. Why? Because it would be flaunting the advantage that men already have in society, where it is expected that they undertake the toughest jobs and the objectification of women is prevalent (leading to harassment, rape etc.).
    We live in a patriarchy. Some dumbass on here said earlier that this is code for men, but that is untrue and he is immature and ignorant. Regardless of any bullshit you think is worth arguing about equal wages, even if we do have equal wages it is not by any means an indication that we live in an equal society.
    Feminism is not only designed to benefit women. The crushing of the patriarchy will also grant freedom to men to undertake any role that they wish to in society. I am not denying that there are inherent qualities that occur more often in men than in women, and vice versa. But gender roles are reinforced with boys from birth, throughout primary school and high school, and these are often dangerous in leading men to believe that they have power over women.
    And I’m male by the way, which means you might fucking listen to me before discarding me as some disillusioned women fighting for their rights which they already have. Stop being a privileged brat and acknowledge that genders are not equal.
    Oh and for whoever said it, Beyonce didn’t ‘sell her body’ or some bullshit in order to earn her place as an entertainer. She dresses what she likes and flaunts her figure as a way to show that men have no power over her. If modelling or in videos she puts herself in empowering positions physically; she’s not submissive to men and her songs aren’t even aimed at men.
    If disputing with me please don’t target some little point, though Marcus I wouldn’t recommend that unless you’re willing to concede for even the smallest second that your privilege is real, the patriarchy is real, women are oppressed, feminism is necessary for men and for women and that you’ve been a misogynist little dick over the course of this comment feed.
    And please don’t pull out any more financial stats. I don’t give a fuck.

    • StubbornlyRational

      Your inability to express yourself in any coherent fashion is quite striking, Saul. The “patriarchy” is a myth, a construction designed to distract from the systematic discrimination and persecution men now face in virtually all areas of our society.

      You state that you want freedom for men to fulfill any ambition and pursue any role. But you say nothing about the way women systematically crush that goal. For example, go to any modern campus. Men are victims of assault on a modern campus at a rate about three times that of women. Men get teeth knocked out in dorm fights, in which often big, strong men bully smaller, weaker men. The weaker men have no “Men’s Assault Counseling Center” to which to turn. There are no special “assault reporting” systems to make sure that male assault is not “systematically underreported.” There is no “Men’s Student Office” dealing with the “unique problems of being male in our society.”

      Saul, I could go on, and on, and on, and on. North American women are (by far) the most privileged class in the history of the world.

      By the way, Saul, men register for selective service. In case the draft were reinstated in a national emergency, men could be drafted. Do you favor selective service registration for women? Why has no female spoken out against this inequity.

      And why are women routinely granted privacy in bathrooms and changing rooms that men are denied? Ever think about that? Try spouting fewer F-words and try thinking a bit harder — if you can.

      • Saul Campion

        You’re failing to understand something very simple. You know the things you’re complaining about, these horrors that men face? Guess what? They’re a result of the patriarchy. The patriarchy is what states that men are the dominant, toughest, most capable class in society, and they are expected to conform to expectations of masculinity. Weaker men are being bashed because they’re not considered masculine enough, and some men hate that. It stems from the same hatred of women and gay/bi/trans/intersex men – they’re not considered masculine enough.

        So the reason that we don’t have a ‘Men’s Assault Counselling Centre’ is because the patriarchy is only working towards assisting the masculine, tough men. Feminism wants to dismantle the patriarchy, and with it, gender expectations, not just those of men. Do you understand? Stop fighting the big ‘feminism’ monster when it’s working towards achieving something you’re concerned about. Forget the myths and accept that this is something that can help you.

        You’re ignoring a large circle. We have a ‘Women’s lounge’ because women feel the need for protection from men, because women are more likely to be harrassed, objectified, abused and ignored than men. These groups exist because of oppression. You know how there are LGBTI clubs in colleges, and how there are no clubs for heterosexuals? You claiming that men should have lounges and special clubs is essentially you chucking a hissy fit that women have something you don’t have, when you don’t actually need it.
        I’m asking that you understand feminism better, and the privilege that white men have.

        North American men are the most privileged class in the world. Women are a long way off for the reasons I mentioned above (harrassed, objectified, abused, ignored). Men face some of this, but comparatively, most of the time they are simply complaining for the sake of it, when they’re not facing many real troubles at all.

        And about selective service. I understand your worries here and the inequality, but women are too busy fighting for their rights in so many crucial areas to worry about working towards equality in the few areas where men are worse off than women, but in brief, this is again because of gender expectations, and the patriarchy, and one feminism can help.

        Please don’t respond unless you’re willing to at least accept the existence of the patriarchy, what feminism can do to stop this, and that white straight males are by far and large the most privileged group on the planet.

        Also, I’m sure the reason for your last point is purely practicality. It’s hardly convenient for a woman to use a urinal. Ever thought about that? Oh, and I sorry that you think my argument lacks credibility because of my use of F-words. Sorry I’m getting so passionate about privileged people denying their privilege and chucking an ignorant tantrum.

        • ou812

          I see, so if it hurts women, it’s Patriarchy. And if it hurts men…that’s also Patriarchy.

    • KhadijahMuhammad

      OK, no financial stats. What I take issue is how you define “equal.” In your view, “equal” is defined as “gender irrelevant”. As a woman, I take issue with that. I am NOT just a man of smaller stature; my entire biology is different, and that biology SHOULD drive certain societal differences.

      Gender “roles” as they are reinforced in society can have several sources, but SOME of those roles are related to biology and the survival of the species. The role of any decent “refomer” ought to be to pick through those role-based differences and determine which ones are traditional/partriarchal (which we can get rid of) but also ASSERT those which are related to biology and the survival of the species. And THAT would be a “smart equality” that we all ought to be able to live with.

      But, the “conventional wisdom” on this topic (at least on the political left) is that all role-based differences must be erased for equality to occur, which is rather irrational and denies the inherent differences between the sexes.

      Count me out.

      • Saul Campion

        People of specific genders may still gravitate to certain roles based upon their inherent traits, and that’s okay, It’s just about people knowing they have the choice. If a women wants to work a top-end job in the workforce, they should be free to do that without societal pressure suggesting that they should be wives and mothers. I agree with your second paragraph, it’s perfectly reasonable. I didn’t intend for my comment to define equal as gender irrelevant.

        • KhadijahMuhammad

          “…they should be free to do that without societal pressure suggesting that they should be wives and mothers.”
          .
          SOCIETAL pressure on this died decades ago. I’m pushing 60, was not raised in a particularly enlightened part of the country, and had no pressures whatsoever pursuing a STEM degree and career at that time.
          .
          There will always be, OTOH, FAMILIAL (different than societal!) pressures on women to take the wife/mother route. Unless there’s a plan to remove the desire for grandkids out of granny (electroshock? chemical brainwashing?) the familial pressures will remain. And I don’t see that as a bad thing.

  • ka

    I’m not entirely sure what to make of it, really. On the one hand, I believe it’s all good and needed that powerful people, and Beyonce is, without a doubt, a powerful person, speak openly about social issues like gender inequality, because the masses will listen to them, even if it’s merely a temporary, short-term celebrity-fuelled attention. On the other hand, when it all comes from a woman who shakes her butt and rubs it against the screen (I realise it may not be the actual case—just generalising), performs hardly clad and poses for GQ—then the words of self-respect suddenly lose their value and shine almost entirely, as I’ve heard hookers talking about self-respect in the similar vein. It would be much more pro-feminist (whatever connotations ‘feminism’ nowadays has—I, for one, mean it in the positive, egalitarian way), if she dared change her somewhat vulgar image and try to gain her attention and retain the position utilising her voice and talent instead of resorting to wriggling her almost naked body (attractive, yes, but that’s not the point) in a primitive, basic instinct-inducing way. Otherwise, a cognitive dissonance occurs, which is, mentally, uncomfortable, and, therefore, requires resolving. That involves some basic logic in the process—and leads to a very simple conclusion: that she’s either stupid or a cynical hypocrite. She doesn’t seem stupid, so we’re left with one other option only. The real problem is, though, not whether she‘s stupid or not, a hypocrite or not—that is her own business; the real problem is many young women believe her, mistake her success for truth and take what she does for being independent and pro-egalitarian, and that is simply not the case—what she does, in the long run, only encourages what she‘s speaking against.

  • Noor

    That’s because women tend to go for jobs that are less demanding, so that they have time to raise their children as well. It’s a very difficult discussion and lots of women feel as if they have to pick between family and their careers however this isn’t always the case… It is possible to have both but that would mean less time with the children that may in fact hold that against their Mums, ‘you never spend any time with me!!!’, ‘you’re always at work!!’ Not only that but a lot of women actually prefer having less demanding jobs because they want their children to be raised by someone they trust the most, themselves.

  • StubbornlyRational

    Any reader interested in the truth instead of the bizarre side-thoughts of a modest-IQ musical performer should reaad “Why Men Earn More…and What Women can Do About It”, by Warren Farrell. It explains the bald-faced lie behind the “77 cents on the dollar” slogan, among other things. In general, women make as much or more than men. By the way, factcheck.org dismisses Beyonce’s statement as an uninformed lie.

  • StubbornlyRational

    Men take almost all the really dangerous jobs, which in some cases pay a lot of money. Almost all industrial accident deaths have male victims. If Beyonce’ is so interested in gender “equality,” why isn’t she railing against the “death gap” in industrial accidents?

  • ra44mr2

    Hey can i be as unequal as Beyonce? I would really like to be oppressed like her.

    And im having trouble finding it, can someone find the link where Beyonce was all upset about the attacks on Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachman? My Google-fu seems to be failing me today.
    In addition did she bother to find out the reasons why that might be? Did she actually bother to ask “WHY?” or do any critical thinking at all and maybe find out what the underlying reasons are for this? Or did she just assume it was the world out to subjugate women even though the unemployment rate for men is quite a bit higher than for women.

  • Uche Okpala © ✉

    No need of calling eachother names here’s not a gossip blog , is where reasonable folks come up with what will make our society better … great topic to be treated cos i’m a witness ..happy new year …

  • MRASoldier

    The Gender Pay Gap myth has already been debunked, but how about addressing these equality issues?

  • Dani Davis

    How about giving men some of the benefits/ rights that women get that man don’t. Women want all the benenifts men get but, non of the responsibility. Men don’t have the option of working just long enough to find some one/ woman to pay thier bills then choosing to stay home. Men work because they have to.

    Y’all need to listen to the Tom Leykis Show available on the tune in app.

    • ra44mr2

      Seems the truth hurts some folks eh Dani? I see the 2 downvotes by the butthurt.

  • KhadijahMuhammad

    “Today, women make up half of the U.S. workforce, but the average working woman earns only 77 percent of what the average working man makes,” Beyoncé wrote.”

    .
    This is misinformed. When you normalize for experience and industry choices, women are at parity with men.

  • http://commentaramapolitics.blogspot.com/ tryanmax

    It’s encouraging to see in the comments before mine that, while Beyonce has fallen for the pay-gap lie, many people know better. Today, women today earn more college degrees and advanced degrees than men, and have lower rates of unemployment. At least one study has found that young, single, childless women earn more than their male counterparts in most metro US areas.

    There is, of course, the argument that women should not have to accept any pause in earnings while taking time off to have and raise children. That would be an argument in favor of equal pay for UN-equal work. It’s a valid if not meritorious position, which is why no one would advocate it straightforwardly.

    As to what we teach our children, where has Beyonce been living? I assume she is addressing a Western audience where, for our whole lives (same age, she and I), “Girl Power” and “Boys Stink” have been commonplace slogans. Those are in addition to the more meaningful campaigns about gender equality from every angle imaginable.

    If there are men who were raised to believe that boys are better than girls, surely they are offset by the women raised to believe girls are better than boys. As a society, we’ve come to have equal disdain for the misogynist AND the misandrist–as evidenced in these comments. I’d say you’ve come a long way, baby. ;-)

  • ksc

    Beyonce as a feminist? I don’t see it. It seems to me that she constantly uses sex to sell her music and the Beyonce “brand.” I enjoy some of her music…but her talk in the media about her “body after baby” and her constant sexualization of herself doesn’t break down barriers for women— sorry.

    • mo toons

      Indeed, can we also talk about her misogynistic husband? Once she cleans up her own back yard, then she might have a place in this discussion.

      • ksc

        true..hadn’t even thought about his lyrics. kudos to you!!

  • trusake

    Beyonce, you’re a woman who earn MILLIONS of dollars just for singing, plus all the other things you sell. I am a man who earn about $20,000 for working at a computer and deal with angry customers. Where’s my equality?

    • Lasondra Thomas

      In the music industry and not at the computer place.

  • Darla

    Major insurance companies pay women just over half of what they pay the men that work right with them. I know this for fact since my partner is paid 40% less than equal male co-workers. She works twice as hard to get paid so much less. These are jobs that require collage degrees. Oh did I say she has many more years experience in the field? Thank You Maria and Beyonce for bring this to the for front.

    • Mstrx

      You are lying and here is why. If that were true, the company would fire tall the men and hire women at half the wages. But that does not happen. You are lying.

      • Max

        Exactly Mstrx: If the insurance company (or any other business) could save 40% on payroll (typically a company’s largest expense) they would jump at it. Besides, I’m pretty sure you and your partner would be calling 1-800-LAWYERS right now if that was true.

        • Lasondra Thomas

          Wrong. They wouldn’t. You guys probably aren’t business owners so I’m sure you know nothing about the ends outweighing the means. A business owner can count on at least half of his female workforce to a) having a baby and b) leaving work permanently after. If he fired all the men and hired all women that would put him in a vulnerable position, with men it is different.He can pretty much count on Joe to show up for the next 15 years without question. In business, an owner wants a stable workforce, while women are great in the workforce they have too many life changes that can affect the stability.

          • Max

            Actually, I am a small business owner, have been for about 20 years, and this is literally the dumbest comment I have ever read, which is saying a lot. Employee turnover and transition happens on a regular basis. Hiring a male over a female (at a significantly higher cost) because maybe the male will stay 15 years is at best a questionable business decision and at worst totally insane. The odds of ALL your female employees getting pregnant at the same time are non-existant and even if by some miracle that happens, you will pretty much get roughly 9 months notice to adjust. Sorry but Ill take the 40% salary difference over the possibility that maybe sometime in 15 years an employee will leave and so would every other rational business owner.

  • Barclay Pollak

    I think Carissa G. has a point. A lot of this goes back to socialization. I agree that boys, from a very young age, are encouraged to participate in more technical endeavors and girls are encouraged to participate in more domestic. I have an eight year old daughter and I’m very proud of her for questioning and in some cases rejecting what has been deemed socially acceptable for little girls.

    As for the difference in pay I can’t say that I have enough information to lean one way or the other. But based on this brief social experiment I can at least see why some may argue the scale is weighted to favor men. http://blog.tdsbusiness.com/tips-advice/helping-women-in-business-tokenism-or-aspirational-assistance/

    • MamaMia

      I strongly disagree, two examples, Norway and Sweden are two feminized countries that means women have more rights and always get privileged over men. Even there only 10-11% technology worker / engineers are women. What does that tell you ? men and women are different, and there is nothing you can do to increase this number other than so called positive discrimination but be aware that putting ineligible people on top will only cost the economy and society.

  • Mstrx

    Good God, what an idiot. Yes, I demand my wife makes more money! So there!

    I think it is time we tell girls and women that it is not fair that men are 90 percent of all workplace fatalities. And it is not fair that men take the jobs no one wants, in locations no one wants to be. We must tell women that it is not fair that men work 10 hours a week more overtime.

    It is not fair that men die five years younger than women and at higher rates from all top ten diseases, and desptie this, there are seven national agencies for womens healht and NONE for men. No FEDERAL AGENCY

    It is not fair that men get 63% higher sentence and more jail time for the SAME CRIME.

    It is not fair that the federal government spends money to recruit girsl to science and math but not a dime to help the boys in reading and their problems are worse.

    WHAT AN IDIOT!

    And are you still sampling the Challenger disaster in callous disregard for their pani? IS THIS HOW YOU THROW OFF THE SCENT?

    • Lasondra Thomas

      Men work 10 hours more because most men refuse the caregiver role hence more time for you to work and less time for mom to work. Kids and home have to be taken care of that’s just how it is.If men started helping out today, women and men would be working the same amount of hours.
      Men can not carry babies for 9 months. Women bring forth life to increase the population which keeps our world existing. There is a reason their are more of us to men. A man can impregnate 100 women and die tomorrow and in 9 months 100 more people would be on the earth. Yet if 100 hundred women died that would be 100 less people available for the new generation. Case in point, China.
      As far as men dying five years younger, it’s no secret men hate going to the doctor, a woman won’t hesitate.
      There is not evidence that states men get higher sentences than women, but there is evidence that men participate in criminal activity wayyyy more than women.

      • Mstrx

        Absolute nonsense.

        Crime first: http://baddatabad.blogspot.no/2013/02/more-crime-stats-male-vs-female.html
        Men get stiffer sentences for the same crime.

        Hours worked: you may offer an interesting interpretaion but the facts are the facts. Men work 10 hours more per week and that is the major reason for the wage difference. You really ought to learn to focus on the arugment and not on tangential interpretations.

        Health. the reason men do not go to the doctor as often is also because we spend more money urging women to go. COMPARE these two sites, and you will see EXACTLY what I mean.
        http://womenshealth.gov
        http://menshealth.gov

        Prostate and breast cancer kill equally, but we spend ten times as much on breast cancer.

        There are seven national agencies for womens health and ZERO for men.

        Don’t be an idiot. LOOK WITH YOUR EYES: The sexism is against men

      • Mstrx

        Oh… one more thing… yes, men participate in crime more. THey are trained to do that by the jail system.
        And 40% of the jails are filled with black men arrested for first time drug use. THAT IS IMMORAL… that black men are targeted first, follwoed by white men. Men get jailed more from the start…. women often walk.

      • MamaMia

        You are clearly an idiot and you are making frivolous claims without backing it. Go and die, you are the pathetic example of a human being, illogical and unreasonable.

  • Mstrx

    Beyonce, are you really that stupid?

    What a damn stupid, ignorant, selfish, arrogant, self-centered, egotistical, greedy jerk you are!

    • http://www.pmurraymusic.com/ P. Murray

      And how, exactly, does your disdain for her help anything or anyone, or do anything for anyone besides yourself? Also, multiple synonyms for stating two basic ideas or epithets do not help justify your rage. It only lessens the blow. Not that she cares, I’m sure.

      • Mstrx

        But it got your attention

  • Mstrx
  • disenfranchisedhuman

    This was a misstep for Beyonce. In addition to reiterating wage-gap myths, her simplistic analysis of complex gendered issues, and the brief nature of her “essay”, she failed to adequately define any of the issues she spoke to resulting in a meaningless discussion. What does she mean by “equality” and “respect”? Equal in what sense? Social, economic, political, intellectual capacity, equally fulfilled, ect.? Are all men “equal” to other men, and all women equal to other women? Is inequality not a natural result and condition of the complex social and capitalistic world we live in? Is inequality not (to some extent) in the eye of the beholder and subject to individual interpretation? What I’m getting at is that these questions are not straight forward and to frame discussion around general ideas of equality and respect as if there is absolute consensus on what they mean (which seem more like liberal principles than feminist) shows how poorly she actually understands women’s issues and the social space in which they occur. It’s too bad because now I’m having a hard time separating her unfortunate commentary from her brilliant album.

  • Mstrx
  • dw

    Can’t have it both ways, she’s a singer, not a booty shaker, this doesn’t help a womans image

  • ra44mr2

    So my wife 10 years my junior, latina, AND making more money than me when i have the bachelors degree and half a masters and she only has an associates degree? Whats that freaking magic? No i will tell you what that is, it was me supporting my wife in her work, me taking time off when needed to watch the kids so she could work the extra hours. That is right backwards from what most couples do and that is why this “pay gap” exists. If more women were more willing to work the extra hours to put in the time then they wouldnt have it. The fact is more men make more money because they put in more time as the woman is generally less inclined to do so.

    • Lasondra Thomas

      We have established that. The key thing you said that all the men here are purposely not mentioning is that you have SUPPORTED your wife by stepping in at home. Most men do not do that hence the gap. Been with my husband 9 years and no matter what happens with our kids or at home, it has always been on me and he will not help out. Arguments over domestic duties occur everyday between men and women. Women often lose, just Google it. Do you men know how many women go through this everyday??Men take for granted that women make sacrifices so that they can enhance their careers. We usually have to take a back seat to you succeeding. Regardless of what men say about the extra hours, you guys keep negating that 99.9% of the time children are involved and 99.9% of the time the men have washed their hands of anything regarded as “womanly duties”. If men believe in fairness, be fair. Help clean at home, help out with the kids. It is not that we are less inclined to do so its that most of the time when it comes to children and the upkeep of our home, we don’t have a choice because men automatically assume superiority with work.Child care and the upkeep of a home is one of those things that has to be done and when a man refuses to do so, we have to take charge. A child can not wait on dad to decide whether or not he/she is important enough to take care of.

      • Mstrx

        Then STFU and divorce him and marry a man who helps. This is YOUR problem, alone.

      • ra44mr2

        This sounds like a “not my problem” thing. This is not something that legislation can fix as is implied by this article. This is something that women have to NOT put up with. Lets look at it this way, if your husband was beating you, and you chose to stay despite all evidence that you should leave, whos fault is it? yes its HIS for hitting you but it would be yours for staying. The implication that the system is flawed is in itself a flawed premise, it isnt the system its PEOPLE. You cannot fix PEOPLE with legislation no matter how hard you try. When you do, you make things worse, if they start legislating that women should be paid more etc then whats going to happen is women wont be hired over men as much because a boss or an owner is going to look at the costs and realize that he can pay a man less for the job and get away with it.

  • Hazel

    Gender equality is a myth. Who ever said women wanted to be equal to men? I dont want to be like a man. There are also problems with masculinity.

    I actually thought that women were now earning more in the USA compare to their male counterparts especially with the decline in manufacturing.

  • http://www.pmurraymusic.com/ P. Murray

    What it sounds like here is an artist who is concerned with the advancement of woman’s rights, and rightfully so, but who probably got fed the wrong bunch of stats. Economic disenfranchisement is a problem that cuts across both gender and racial lines, and is usually the catalyst for many of the other “-isms” that make up the bulk of the world’s social problems today (i.e. racism, sexism, classism, anti-semitism, etc.). I don’t feel like she was wrong in her feminist convictions, but there are definitely serious holes in her fact-checking. Sadly, she will have to take the brunt of the blow for what is a much larger problem of misinformation when it comes to gender equality and women’s rights. This will be on top of the myriad of folks who already have it out for her simply because she is who she is. But this is how we learn as individuals; sometimes we have to say the wrong thing with a loud voice in order for people to explain what the right thing is. Most of you all commenting will forget about this by tomorrow anyway. LOL ;-)

  • SRR126

    Funny thing – when you look at occupations such as engineering; accounting; medicine; law – women all earn the same.
    It is only when they drop out or take part-time work that they lose out
    Now I know what we need to do – pay everyone the same regardless of effort; experience; education – yeah – that will do it.

  • Sandy0

    It’s NOT gender equality we need to discuss—>it’s GENDER-EQUAL TREATMENT. Trust me. I doubt ANYONE anyone has worked as hard as I/we of National Equal Rights Amendment Alliance has for equal treatment of male and female alike! “Equality” has had a nice ring to it for 40 years, until we of the Alliance realized that word has no gravitas like “equal treatment” HAS! Hard to describe or measure the abstract,. “equality”, BUT “equal treatment” is quite different–UNEQUAL TREATMENT OF ANY GROUP IS QUITE OBVIOUS! So let’s go from there, please.

    Just from this article, let’s discard a flaw that’s new to our wisdom but Very apparent in reality when job-hunting 2014: A college education does NOT buy you a good job as it once did. In fact, AAUW and other studies are NOW showing that as women progress through the college education, their wage gap re men’s , DROPS! There is a now a huge and GROWING DISPARITY in wages between males and females as women climb higher in education!! And there’s a lot of college-educated guys, though not with women’s higher grades, who can only get jobs flipping burgers! Are you surprised? I’m sorry, but it’s True. I don’t have an answer, just that I do know that generall the more education, the more capable you are in any job. It’s just not a “given” that you’ll get a top job anymore nor even A job!

    Stick with us of the National Equal Rights Amendment Alliance (ERA) which has been savagely striving for that amendment to the US Constitution would have gotten voted in by now 2014! ERA Would make Sex Discrimination a “violation of the US Constitution” in many cases.

    WHY ARE WE WOMEN, GIRLS STILL ALLOWING LEGISLATORS TO IGNORE!IGNORE! women passed over at work simply because they are Not men?. Women and girls are stalked, grabbed, raped and murdered! Our young millennials now do live in a Rape Culture like none other! Why don’t we fix that by passing ERA,the only Constitutional amendment codified just to protect the underclass, women and girls??

    ERA is now before the Florida legislature and several others. THOSE LEGISLATORS COULD FIX THIS! But they basically ignore this American epidemic and other blatant sex discrimination. We do not know why. Do YOU???

  • Scott Nailon

    I agree that anyone working in a job, male female or child should be paid the same amount – OR should be paid for the level of work they are able to do…

    But in real life equality is not possible.

    Why do I say this?

    Well… lets parallel this with a Fish and a monkey.

    The Fish and the Monkey are made different, they can do different things better then each other.
    Just like a Monkey wont beat a fish of the same size at a swimming race, likewise a fish wont EVER climb a tree better then a monkey can….

    We all have equal worth – I agree with that though.

    In some cases I would say a man should be paid LESS then a woman for certain things – depending on his ability.

  • Scott Nailon

    BTW: Womens pay was dropped after the War because there were not enough jobs left for the men who came home needing to pay the way for their families. So they tried everything to get things to return to normal again, but some women decided they likes working more then keeping a home etc – thats where all the friction began.

    Nothing good comes from War.

  • ceruleanblue777

    How many women work in mines, in construction, lay asphalt, build bridges, clean windows on skyscrapers, collect garbage, work in sewers?

  • ceruleanblue777

    Beyoncé is a gender supremacist. “Girls rule the world.”

  • ceruleanblue777

    Maybe the next time Beyoncé plays for a dictator and gets caught like she did when she played for Gadaffi and she wants to get rid of the bad PR, she can donate the money she made to decrease the mythical “wage gap”.

    • ddw5473

      She should shut up and sing, or lip sync…whatever it is she does. Mostly to songs somebody else (male?) has written for her.

  • Beyonce knows better

    Until women demand equal consequence under law, equal pay will never be a reality. It’s too bad Beyonce is so misguided as to not look to responsibly, but instead goes to begging she knows better. Why not stand up as a proud woman and say that women need to take full responsibility for what they have done and If a man would be punish, so should a woman. if the sentence is long and difficult a woman ought to pay that same price. a REAL woman would step up and demand full equality and not accept favoritism based on gender and then equal pay would follow. but if think you’d know that already… this is just something singers say to look like they’re on the in of what’s popular.

  • MamaMia

    Anyone who is turning to feminism is becoming a liar, knowingly or unknowingly. I like to give Beyonce a benefit of doubt and I will call her misinformed and she can do better. Feminists have been lieing to us for many years, they also obstructed free speech. Follow these links and educate yourself.

    Rape culture
    http://www.leaderu.com/real/ri9502/sommers.html

    Domestic violence lies
    http://www.pubpages.unh.edu/~mas2/V71-Straus_Thirty-Years-Denying-Evidence-PV_10.pdf

    Obstruction of free speech
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iARHCxAMAO0&safe=active

    Violence
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crTgqIJ6kMY

    Women are sexist
    infowars.com/dhs-just-cant-get-it-together-suzanne-barr-resigns/
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muuFygvXPAM

    Women are more violent than men
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/women-are-more-violent-says-study-622388.html

    How current system is failing boys.
    foxnews.com/opinion/2012/11/24/war-on-men/

    Women privileges:
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2132752/Mother-killed-train-toilet-fireball-anniversary-day-stabbed-year-old-son-death.html

    http://www.opposingviews.com/i/society/girlfriend-chases-boyfriend-store-without-pants-refusing-sex-attacks-him

    http://divorcesupport.about.com/od/abusiverelationships/a/male_abuse.htm

    http://translate.google.de/translate?sl=de&tl=en&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&eotf=1&u=http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/gesellschaft/degs-studie-auch-maenner-werden-in-beziehungen-opfer-von-gewalt-a-902153.html

    http://www.prb.org/Publications/Reports/2010/singlemotherfamilies.aspx

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/fla-mom-allegedly-kills-teens-murder-suicide-cops-article-1.1579512

    Feminists had made relationship between men and women increasingly difficult and almost impossible. I urge people, do not listen to feminists. If we have some problem in the society we will fix it by activism but it should not be under the umbrella feminism.

  • MamaMia

    The thing is men and women are different and they will always be different and will make different choices in general. The most gender neutral countries such as norway and sweden, it is found that 10-11% engineers are women and rest are men and opposite is true in health care jobs.

    Here is the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrsF7wyUxs8&safe=active
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm5mDjxuOKY
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOb1b8GYH6c
    Stop wasting time and resources for social engineering, Stop wasting taxpayers money, my money to bring more women to these disciplines because you can not. They are different and they will always be different.

  • pat

    Thank you everyone at The Shiver Report !! You are doing a Wonderful job! It means so much to so many of us that people like you care about poverty. Lets look for solutions for the increasing poverty in America. God Bless you at The Shiver Report sending best of wishes with deep gratitude.

  • http://www.themadjewess.com/ The Mad Jewess

    Women are not as physically strong as men.
    Case closed.

  • Alex Pahomoff

    On the contrary – it is a myth that Beyonce wrote. Women earn on average less money because they do not go to the more severe, highly and dangerous professions, as opposed to men (for example, factories, construction buildings and mines, where the pay is more).

  • Jacqueline Joyce

    I became a middle manager at the tender age of 21 earning twice the UK average salary per annum. This was without a degree. I worked for British Telecom where I felt valued as an individual and blossomed because of this. After my first child my husband played house father but was not comfortable at the baby groups as he was the only man there. In a marriage both of you need to feel worthwhile and so I encouraged and supported him with an eye on the bigger picture (monogamous married loving bliss). Although we are financially comfortable, married and I believe monogamous I now understand the nature of man which is quite different to that of woman, Mrs Carter already sees ‘if I was a boy’ what it has taken me a lifetime to not yet fully understand. In the UK a new law will mean that when a couple have a child either the man or woman can take the parental leave. I am now an employer and believe this will be a great leveller as legally the father has the same opportunity to bond with baby.

    We must also protect the rights of woman who are not aware there rights are being abused. Certain lectures in UK universities requested that the women sat at the back and wrote down any questions and the men sat at the front and could speak at will. These were lectures by a specific cultural group but I find it shocking and see it as brainwashing females into not speaking unless through a man. If not already unlawful it certainly should be. HOW DARE THEY!

  • amber

    so…….. everyone is happy to see Americas children growing up in Poverty?

  • Carl Hinton

    If a time comes when straight men willingly wear skirts, dresses, high heels and stockings and have babies. If a time comes when women do hard manual labour and take risky jobs like fire-fighting and don’t mind when a man doesn’t open the door for her then all things will be equal. BUT, do we really want a world like that? Men and women were made different, we should rejoice in that diversity.

    • Isalill Kolpus

      if you think that is feminism, you’ve got it all wrong. The point is to ensure equal possibilities for the sexes. Not that half of all fire fighters in the world should be women, but all women who wants to become a fire fighter, should have the opportunity to become one. And that all men who would like to be nurses should try. Giving room for both sexes is celebrating the diversity. Shutting doors for 50 % of the earths population is not. Saying that everybody can aspire to become something is feminism. Telling women there are jobs they can never have is not. Equality is not splitting all types of jobs down the middle and saying that one part is reserved to men and the other to women. Equality is saying that all jobs are open to anyone with the qualifications to do said job, without regards to sex or gender.

      • visionary_23

        Feminism = also using public policy to push for equal women representation in higher paying, safer jobs (like those in Tech fields), but not doing the same for lower paying, much more unsafe jobs (like those in coal mining), and acting like there’s no hypocrisy.

        Feminism — advancing female rights and male responsibility no matter the cost since 1990.

  • Afro Prepper

    What makes women think that they would be shielded from the economy if men lose their jobs. What office buildings are women going to be working in if men don’t build them? Where and how are women going to be making all this money in a society that’s not built and maintained by men? Where do women get off thinking that they are completely autonomous from men to the point that “if it wasn’t for men holding them back” they’d be CEO. CEO of what company, and what building that MEN didn’t build? I feel like women fail to understand how the economy works, and as a black woman – BEYONCE – why doesn’t she just said “WHITE MEN” because I’d sure like to know where this kick behind black community is where black men are in the financial position to not only pay black women less, but also do the hiring. Last time I checked, due to the economic disparities in this country, black women get all their jobs from WHITE MEN, not black men. So they need to file the complaints about what they are being denied with the white boys rather then a general “MAN” complaint.

    I’d really like to know what INFRASTRUCTURE women are going to control or have 50% say over that they don’t build. Even with all this government subsidizing for women, eventually the system will crash because with the increase numbers of failing, unemployed, and underemployed men, EVENTUALLY you will have more women taking money OUT of the system than you have gainfully employed men putting money into the system. If men don’t do well – women don’t do well. It seems to me that women have a VERY hard time accepting the REALITY that EVERYTHING women do is predicated on the foundations that men establish – FIRST!

    A woman can’t be “strong and independent” unless some men get finished building the AIR CONDITIONED office building for her first. Please someone direct me to the army of women who are trying to get those jobs that aren’t cushy or glamourous but are CRUCIAL to the infrastructure of society. Women work in the services industry, and by choice. It’s clean and comfortable, but they seem to fail, every time, to see that if the grueling work men do isn’t supported by manufacturing, mining, and exportation of goods, there WILL BE NO STRONG INDEPENDENT JOBS FOR WOMEN TO WORK.

    That’s how society works, but women seem to miss this crucial fact.

    • kerrie_30

      there are women builders, joiners, electricians and engineers so they too build the building, install the air conditioning, granted it is mostly a male role but some women would and do these roles too.

  • tensacross

    This 77% myth has been debunked SO MANY TIMES. Wtf. This throws the entire “shriver report” into question.
    Don’t believe me? Just look!
    https://www.google.com/search?q=77+percent+myth&oq=77+per&aqs=chrome.0.69i59j69i57j5j69i61j0&client=ms-android-sonymobile&sourceid=chrome-mobile&espv=1&ie=UTF-8

    But of course the corporate plutocracy loves for liberals to be fighting a non existent wage gap. It’s a perfect distraction from fighting the REAL WAGE GAP, the only one that matters, between the 1% and the rest of us!

  • Speakmymind

    I am a women, and I feel that we do have the same opportunities as men. It’s just harder for us to fulfill these opportunities because some people out there, the people who run things, subconsciously see women as being weak and not as smart as an average man.

  • Janet Saunder

    the 77 cent statistic is incorrect. Women make 33 cent to the dollar. The 77 cents only applies to full time jobs. We make 1/3 of what males make.

  • Shake

    It’s ironic Beyonce is calling something a myth while simultaneously citing the 77 cents statistic which has been debunked as a myth a LOOONG time ago. Hell, the president was called a liar by the fact checking site politifact for citing that statistic years ago, yet it persists.

    Again: that stat is based on an aggregate. The US Census Bureau got all men and women of working age together, tallied up their wages, then came up with an average. What it means is that a female bartender is lumped in with a male brain surgeon. It’s like saying ”Mexicans make less than white men its racism I tells you”

    Uh…no. It’s because most Mexicans are immigrants that work low wage jobs. Similarly, most women work in lower earning professions (education) and tend to work lower hours while also taking time away for child rearing. What this means is that it brings down the average. Hell, female CEO’s tend to make less than men, but THEY ARE THEIR OWN BOSSES. THIS COMPLETELY FACTORS OUT DISCRIMINATION.

  • globallove

    her heart’s in the right place, but this essay would receive a C+ in Women Studies 101. Its just a C paper, period.

  • koko

    He Knowles cut the girls is bad.
    Cut he tboys is ok.
    That sexism, true.
    The most sexist and vile thing to do boys.
    The history of the elephant in the hallway.

  • i_am_confused

    Oh please, I’ve had more female bosses in my life than I have male & I’m 35 years old. You sexist cows need to grow up & quit crying over inequalities that haven’t existed in an entire generation. You people are pathetic!!!

  • Gern blanstead

    I don’t see this as a women only issue, but an issue facing all Americans. Company’s simply pay less because the American workforce is not unionized and therefore pushed around financially. The Home Depot had 24 billion in revenue last year. Moats all there workers but for a few managers make 8-9 dollars an hour and are kept at 27 hour weeks so they don’t have to pay any insurance. The owners and stock holders make millions on the backs of male and female Americans many just like ms. Gilbert. This is not the america I want to live in. If Home Depot was around in 1955all the employees would be paid middle class incomes they could live on. The American dream is gone because Americans don’t demand fair wages and the piece of the pie they have earned fairly and honestly. No unions, no leverage. This is why ms Gilbert is screwed. (14 cent an hour raise to take care of someone’s parent and treat them with compassion And love like they were ms Gilbert’s own parents. You are an angel ms Gilbert., and your reward is in heaven, but unless you band together with others and unionize., your American dream will remain a living nightmare. Fight for what you work for. Demand better.

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